Can China inherit the Earth? Attention Atheists: Have More Kids!

Ok so anyway, speaking with less of my usual bone dry humor:

Yes I admit it's valuable to hear reactions to my suppositions.

More broadly I'm aware of the suicides directly caused by the Mormon Church with regard to the gay issue, and also at least one suicide connected with masturbation shaming.

So on first glance it's easy for me to be part of the Pride parade.

Damn. If it weren't for my uncle & nephew, I'd be there cheering maybe with my shirt off also, showing off my sexy man boobs to all the participants.

Oh well. Regardless of the opinions of one guy in bass ackward Utardia, humanity will move forward.

More kids. Have more kids. Attention, atheists: the religious are having many more kids than you. The Bible Beaters. The Mormons. The Islam people.

Can China inherit the Earth?

Not so bad of a proposition - in the long term. Communism will hopefully drop away more in the long term. The one child thing will probably eventually drop off.

No Mormonism. No Utah. No Catholicism. No Islam (not much). Light Buddhism. Not so bad. Good old fashioned family values (children first, elder respect, etc).

I'm trying not to step in the shit of Mormonism while also calling attention to a bit of poop I've seen on the other side. Difficult...

Did Jewish Circumcision help lead to the Holocaust? | Both sides are right (& wrong).

All sides are right (& wrong), liberals, moderates, & conservatives.

All sides are right - all sides have valid points. And all sides are wrong also.

Attention atheist groups: I don't want to be in your religions. I left one religion already. I don't wish to join yours. I don't wish to kiss the ass of your de facto priests. I don't wish to join your chump chorus of ultra-liberalism.

It's been a long hard road. I've examined what goes on with "the left," and I've found it to be just as abusive as what goes on with "the right."

Key background:

1. Spending 26 years in the Mormon Church.
2. Went on a Mormon mission to Alaska.
3. Going to Rick College for a year (now BYU Idaho).
4. Being a temple worker in more than one Mormon temple.
5. Going to BYU in Provo, Utah for a year.
6. Leaving the Mormon Church.
7. Living in Texas.
8. Living in Oregon, checking out the wild Alice-in-Wonderland-style scene there & the fucking hippies.
9. Marrying a woman from China, where they've had pretty much zero exposure to Mormonism, Catholicism, & most other churches, and examining what their views are.
10. Hearing from people like Steven Pinker with his book The Blank Slate. Also from Daniel Dennett, Sam Harris, and Christopher Hitchens.
11. Daniel Dennett talking about how religion is a natural phenomenon.
12. Making note of how I had one uncle who grew up in Manti, Utah (ultra conservative Mormon small town). This uncle went to San Francisco to "let it all hang out," to apparently rebel against his ultra-conservative upbringing. He ended up dying of AIDS as a supposedly gay man, leaving his straight family with no father. WTF. A victim of BOTH Mormonism, and the gay freaks of San Francisco. Forced to jump from one side directly to the other. Abused by both!
13. Making note of the drunk bum aunt with no kids I knew as a child, the one who'd often phone my father while drunk. No kids of her own. A dead end largely meaningless life.
14. Making note of my gay nephew who leads an incredibly petty, shallow, and misguided life as an angle reader, and as a guy who readily accepts convicted pedophiles into his network of friends - I saw this first hand. Also making note of my many experiences going out with this nephew to gay bars & parties, and observing first hand the narcissistic messed-up people who tend to show up to such events (friends of my nephew). Truman Capote types. Shallow, sorry, messed up, narcissistic, people.
15. And yet (!) also making note of the service oriented gay people who help us & other people, and whose life work is centered around helping others. Also making note of the life work of people like Stephen Fry & Oscar Wilde.
16. Making note of how BOTH ultra conservatism and ultra liberalism are abusive to the progress of humanity.

Examples of how both sides are right (& wrong):

On abortion:

Yes, Margaret Sanger was a eugenicist, and Peter Singer is an amoral fuck.

After-viability abortion is murder.

Before viability (the closer to conception & the further away from viability), the more "choice" there is that can be reasonably allowed.

In the case of the average crack whore pregnancy, or rape, or incest: before viability, the "choice" is still there to help prevent the birth. But, once viability is reached, the point of "choice" has fully & completely passed.

On the whole gay thing:

It's true that a gay marriage is not the same as straight marriage. Gay sex is not the same as straight sex.

Straight sex & straight marriage is inherently more valuable, to humanity, and to the individual, and to human flourishing!

Gay sex is not as inherently valuable as straight sex. Gay sex is inherently a dead end.

Whatever the biological underpinnings are for being gay, because of the nature of how sex works in humans (& other animals), unless you work to avoid it you may end up having a dead end stunted life.

I was a liberal chump about this issue in the past. Now, as per taking a step back and examining what I observed first hand both with my gay nephew & gay uncle, I've changed by views.

And yet: There are service oriented gay people who spend their lives helping others. That's great! And I value the life work of people like Stephen Fry & Oscar Wilde!

It's true that gay people shouldn't be discriminated against regarding apartments or jobs! They should be able to have civil unions.

But on the other hand, when we talk about things like adoptions, or having children around, a straight kid growing up in a gay household will not have his or her straightness valued as much - by default. The abusive narcissistic petty dead end shit that goes on in gay culture could well easily mess up any otherwise-normal straight kid growing up around gay culture. So the right does have a point about this!

A certain level of concern regarding homosexuality is good, but on the other hand, the ultra-right goes way to far with their level of concern.

For example, in Mormonism they tell their children that masturbation can lead to homosexuality. Such a claim is child abuse. And of course the stance of Uganda on the issue is abusive. So the right goes way to far in their condemnation.

We shouldn't be as harsh as the right on the issue, nor as open as the left.

Children may NEED a mommy & a daddy, to be healthy, happy, well rounded, and thrive.

So like it or not, both sides are right, to a point, and with appropriate caveats.

On environmentalism, tree hugging, and overpopulation:

How are both sides right?

We do need to work to preserve & protect the garden. Yes that's quite true. Humans DO contribute to global warming. Also true. BUT, on the other hand, population control IS an abusive response!

Science & technology are the answers! Nothing else is! NOT forced population control on a personal or country level! That is an abusive response!

There's no such thing as overpopulation in first world countries - this is quite true. And humans DO come first above other animals and plants.

Liberal ideology, prompting you to be childless, may leave you a zero on the great mandala.

From what I've seen: Liberals hate children, normal families, and so on. STFU Parents is the tip of the iceburg. It seems to me that: liberals hate having children, and the normal family structure.

Your average college age kid will go to a liberal college or university & come away convinced that he or she should probably not have kids of his or her own because of concern over the environment. Abusive. Wrong headed. Brainwashing. Just as much braining washing by the left as what goes on with the right.

For the relativist liberal their ideal "family" is a childless one - because then the environment and the Earth is protected - supposedly. Stupid. Abusive. Such wrong headed evil ideology will lead them, and everyone sucked in by such ideology, to be pretty much a zero in the long term. Win or loose now you must choose now. Where will you be the tapestry of life?

Lesbians at the weekly Thursday coffee chat of Atheists of Utah claim that Mormons who have a lot of kids are stupid. However it's the angry loud mouthed lesbians who're being stupid. Who will have the last laugh in 100 years?

I remember the related talk I gave at my mother's funeral at a Mormon meeting house.

Additional thoughts on all these issues:

To fully accept the equality of gay marriage the left must first assume that having children is not a valuable thing.

It's a good thing that we want to have kids - for many reasons. Not just because we're horny. Children are our future. And the liberal death cult is rather quite similar to the Shakers. The childfree life, and the homosexual lifestyle, is de facto celibacy.

Read this article:
http://www.strangenotions.com/very-sad-childfree-life/

Simply replace the word "god" with "14.5 billion years of evolution by natural selection." I know it's hard, but try to see though the Bible-centered language - through to our incredibly deep history as a species. DOES HAVING NO CHILDREN really honor your own personal billion-year history?

Being childfree is sad, petty, and ultimately a dead end. A death cult, by any other name, is still a death cult.

But, read what the Guardian says about the issue:
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/aug/16/choice-child-free-admirable-not-selfish

Leftist relativist brain washing. Leftist dogma that will stunt your life!

No, having a dog or cat around is not the same as a having human child! Not the same in the fucking least. Abused by liberalism, just as much as you may have been abused by conservatism!

Go to the First Unitarian Church of Salt Lake City. There you will find a congregation of grey haried liberals who don't really value having children, and normal families. Cultural relativists being abused by their own anti-children anti-family leftist ideology.

De facto religions of atheism & humanism are abusive.

But on the other hand (!!!): Rightist religions like are Mormonism are also abusive, for example when they tell children that masturbation is evil, should be feared, & may well lead to homosexuality.

Catholicism is also of course abusive when it comes to child raping priests. But, both Mormonism & Catholicism DO have valid points when it comes to abortion & birth control. Yes, you ARE abusing yourself if you exclude the possibility of children from your life!

It's a damn fucking hard truth to realize that very valuable & good elements of positive human morality can be fully rooted within otherwise abusive religion.

HOW can we realize this?

By examining what non-Catholic non-Mormon human cultures do and think!

Go to fucking China!

Take a step back!

Also consider again the double edged sword of Daniel Dennett's true revelation that religion is a natural phenomenon.

More on the problems with leftist religion:

The largely leftist religion of Judaism, which engages in the mass genital rape of their children, is very abusive.

Recently I toured the Holocaust Museum in Washington, D.C.

Here's a hard question for the religion of Judaism:

Is your own promotion of separation from other groups, as part of your religion, in any way responsible for the past expression of fully natural human out-group morality, natural human out-group morality which was expressed in the past?

Forced genital rape of your own children.

Teaching your children that they are better than others.

Such actions naturally caused other groups of humans to more readily express natural human out-group morality in your case. Like it or not.

Examining what happened with Naziism and the Holocaust is rather like staring human out-group morality directly in the face.

The Nazis were fully human, humans expressing out-group morality.

And when your religion promotes separation between your group & others, you could well more easily fall victim to sociopathic nut jobs like Hitler who were able to effectively take advantage of this fully natural readily available negative side of built-in human morality.

Group think. Mob mentality. Survival morality. Nationalism. Provincialism. And even the Old Testament is completely filled with expressions of advocacy for out-group morality.

For Judaism here's a hopeful website:

http://www.jewsagainstcircumcision.org

Life is not so simple.

--------------

Don't want me in your atheist church? I don't want to be in your church.

I don't accept your religion, left or right. Rather I want to be an advocate for science, helpful progress which promotes widespread happiness, well being & health, and survival.

Truth & honestly are required for healthy progress. That means staring our own history in the face and being willing to accept what we see. And to then try to work through what we see clearly.

Mormon Bishops DO abuse children in their care when they teach children that masturbation is evil & may lead to homosexaulity.

And yet, homosexual couples do PERHAPS abuse children by raising them in forcibly-relativist dogmatically politically correct households where straightness is not valued, nor honored, nor supported, nor promoted.

So BOTH sides are being abusive, ok?

The answer to conservatism is not liberalism. Instead it's honest science, observation, and tying into ALL of what it means to be human (including being willing to shame & blame & judge where appropriate & useful - !!!). A VERY VERY fucking hard thing for an ex-conservative-religionist to accept! Damn hard.

-----

Thank goodness the Internet is expanding our in-group morality.

There is hope though. In all religions people are becoming less abusive. It just takes time.

And, let me say there's aspects of ALL cultures & religions which I personally value.

I'm PRO-human. Pro-happy-human. Pro-true-and-honest-naturalism, in as much as being for those natural parts of us which can help us be happy. But, I'm also pro-honesty. Falling into naturalistic fallacies is also a consideration.

We have to be willing to look ourselves in the mirror, and to help promote what looks good, and remove the pimples which don't. That's all.

---

Did Jewish Circumcision help lead to the Holocaust? | Both sides are right: Liberals & Conservatives

Social conservatism. Social liberalism. Politics. Etc.

Photos from April 2014 visit to China

http://public.fotki.com/petcrows-April-2014/china-april-2014/

thoughts on Ukraine - February 2014

Ukraine has been in the news recently. In Portland I met a very nice family from Ukraine, an experience which led in part to a desire to seek about seeking a wife from there. That experience resulted in the following:

1. Several blind dates, with about 30% normal women, 50% women who wanted nothing more than a free meal from an American man, and 20% outright thieving women.

These dates were orchistrated via the following sites:

http://www.kievconnections.com
and http://www.elenasmodels.com

2. Tours of sites in Ukraine which normal tourists would never see. Swimming in a large river near Kiev. Touring cathedrals & seeing the circus. Visit to Soviet-era-looking towns and staying in similar style hotels. Visits to Odessa & the surrounding area. Odessa was known as a city of thieves. It still deserves that label, unfortunately.

A pretty face can bring ready cash. Pretend to be interested in real relationships with foreign men, and suddenly, cha-ching, the cash starts flowing in. Yes there are certainly honest hard working down to Earth people in Ukraine. It's just that most such people do not, in my view & experience, visit agencies to help them meet foriegn men to marry. It's something about the culture perhaps.

China is different. Chinese women. You will have better luck with women from China. Less likely to cheat & deceive. More hard working. A higher liklihood that you will be approached honestly & for the same purpose as you are out looking. Women not just looking for a free meal or a one night stand.

Anyway, so far I've created two video commentaries about Ukraine since they've been in the news recently.

Ukraine, freedom, dating scams, thieves, dating advise, & related thoughts - 2-20-2014

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ed0XK8CQc4Y

Mr. Beeb and the Birdies; more thoughts on Ukraine; the naivete of liberal relativism
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6aZLm-ZAjN8

Commentary included with video 1:

Check out:
https://www.kyivpost.com/content/kyiv/euromaidan-rallies-in-ukraine-feb-19-live-updates-337098.html

Oh my. The place is trashed. What's my impression of Ukraine?

1. Some normal honest people.
2. A great number of thieves present. Here's one example: http://www.romancescam.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=32263

In Portland I met a very nice family from Ukraine. Before coming to my senses and marrying a nice woman from China, I went on some blind dates with some Ukraine women. Some were normal. Some were just wanted a free meal / date. And at least one or two were outright thieves.

Also the wallet drop scam was tried on me in downtown Kiev right near the central square where a lot of the fighting is currently happening.
https://www.kyivpost.com/content/ukraine/kyivs-scammers-target-easy-prey-foreigners-30791.html

Why does Moscow care so much about Kiev? Because that's where their ancestors came from. But if they want to all be Ukrainian at heart why did they move to Moscow?

Russians want Ukraine to essentially be & remain a de facto Russian state / province. But a lot of Ukrainians don't appreciate the boot of Putin.

In a bar in Odessa I remember one man telling me "we just want people outside of Ukraine to view it like it's a regular normal country."

If the protests succeed and if the place can be one where the former PM is not imprisoned by the current president and so on, then perhaps the man's dream can come true.

As for the dating scam women and all of the wallet dropping scam men, I rather hope they all move somewhere else. Maybe to Putin's neighborhood.

Related book:
Tales Of Old Odessa: Crime And Civility In A City Of Thieves
http://www.wilsoncenter.org/publication/tales-old-odessa-crime-and-civility-city-thieves
http://www.amazon.com/Tales-Old-Odessa-Civility-Thieves/dp/0875803466

City of thieves indeed. There are normal down to Earth honest people in Ukraine, but they are unfortunately surrounded by a bunch of crooks. Maybe the normal people want to throw the crooks out.

2-20-2014 7:35am and afternoon

Commentary included with video 2:

Mr. Beeb and the Birdies; more thoughts on Ukraine; the naivete of liberal relativism.

Regarding Ukraine I found the following this morning:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0DxkDiAcSF8
as on the BBC for a time and at
http://www.kyivpost.com/content/kyiv/euromaidan-rallies-in-ukraine-feb-21-live-updates-337287.html

To find, in my view & opinion, 30% normal women, 50% women who are interested in nothing more than a free meal from a foreigner (and a one night stand with a big spender), and 20% women who are outright thieves visit: http://www.kievconnections.com
About the same odds later findable at: http://www.elenasmodels.com

Recommendations instead for dating & marriage: In the first instance first hand interaction & offline introductions. Online later, but only AFTER a real flesh & blood first hand introduction by a friend or college. This applies both to seeking someone here or abroad. And in my view and first hand experience, women from China will tend to be more honest with you regarding what exactly they're approaching you for than women from Ukraine, Russia, or similar countries. Yes there are honest down to Earth women in the former-USSR countries, but you have to do more sifting to find them. Does the woman want to go buy expensive shoes or clothing immediate after your first dinner date? Is she eager for you to meet her family? Does she call you at odd hours of the night to request emergency cash? All these are signs that you're simply being used.

Anyway I'm lucky to have found the woman I did, and that friends in the US were able to help coordinate our initial contact. A beautiful son has so far been the result.

Regarding politics, liberalism & conservatism: My preference is to now take the Hitchens approach. Question everything in the first instance, and then see where the evidence lies. Sometimes conservative or moderate ideals end up being correct, after examining sufficient evidence. A hard truth for a liberal to admit.

2-21-2014 7:22am

Chinese Garden in Salt Lake City /// Teabagger chumps of Koch brothers - government shutdown

Commentary on two topics:

Topic 1: Rich traitorous bastard teabagger engineered government shutdown conspiracy revealed.

Topic 2: The Chinese garden in International Peace Gardens, Jordan Park, Salt Lake City is being hijacked by anti-China Taiwanese expats.

Video:


Links and more references:

On topic 1: The government shutdown, and the traitoris Koch brothers & their tea bagging chump de facto followers...

A Federal Budget Crisis Months in the Planning
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/10/06/us/a-federal-budget-crisis-months-in-the-planning.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

Shutdown coverage fails Americans
http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2013/10/1/reporting-governmentshutdowndemocracy.html

The 5 creepiest things about how the Koch brothers engineered the shutdown
http://www.deathandtaxesmag.com/207311/the-5-creepiest-things-about-how-the-koch-brothers-engineered-the-shutdown/

Conservative Plot To Defund Obamacare Exposed
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQmGqCOwy2U

On topic 2:

United Nations resolution 2758 - why Taiwan is not a member of the U.N.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_General_Assembly_Resolution_2758

Legal status of Taiwan - in dispute:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_status_of_Taiwan#Arguments_for_United_States_sovereignty_claims

Can you find Taiwan on a map? When someone says the word China, does Taiwan come to mind? Probably not! See the letter I sent to Salt Lake City on this issue, and my linked to video at the top of this post for more details...

---------- Forwarded message ----------
To the Salt Lake City Parks Dept.
Date: Mon, Sep 30, 2013
Subject: no Chinese flag in Peace Garden

Hello,

I've noticed there is no flag for the People's Republic of China in the International Peace Garden in Jordan Park.

Is the purpose of the garden to "foster world peace?" Some people may well want the government of Taiwan to be the "official" government of the Chinese mainland. But no matter how much we may want that & wish for that, it's unlikely to happen. And using the peace garden here as a means of
"sticking it in the eye" of the current, actual, and real government of China, is rather inappropriate.

Does the U.S. need to "make peace" with Taiwan? Hardly.

You're brave enough to have a flag for Vietnam in there. Perhaps there's a plot for Russia. But you can't handle having a flag for the People's Republic of China?

When diplomats from China visit Utah, do they ever drop by the Peace Gardens? Are they confronted with the Taiwanese flag there? But when they go searching for the flag from their country, can they find it? No.

Anyway, I know the people in Taiwan are really quite angry with the government in Beijing. But it seems to me that using the Peace Garden as a platform for their anger doesn't really "foster peace."

And so, your garden, our "peace" garden (since it is a public place) is not really and truly a garden for peace.

Maybe fly BOTH flags in the Chinese garden - both for Taiwan and for regular China. Maybe if you did that the Chinese garden there would be for ALL of China, and not just for an angry subset who want to overthrow the gov in Beijing.

A private group has essentially hijacked the garden. Yes they made it look nice, and I know it was just redone. That's nice. But Taiwan is NOT the government of China, and hand wringing by right-wing McCarthyite politicians in Utah, or even by Taiwanese expats, isn't going to change that.

So, for your/our Chinese garden I ask that you have a flag for China, the People's Republic of China, there.

We can be for freedom for Taiwan without discounting the fact that the People's Republic even exists in the first place. China, the People's Republic thereof, is here to stay. And your garden shouldn't deny that fact, or serve as a means of "sticking it" to the government in Beijing. However noble that cause may be, it's an inappropriate antithetical action by a supposed "peace garden."

My wife is from mainland China, and we were married in the Chinese garden. My wife is not from Taiwan. Maybe you can have a Taiwan garden in the Garden, but as far as we're concerned we were married in the CHINESE garden, not in an exclusively-Taiwanese-centered one. My wife found the presence of the Taiwanese flag and the absence of the Chinese one strange, and an indication that "Americans don't like China."

I agree that the current situation is divisive. Do we have a "peace garden" here or what? Does the City of Salt Lake want America to have peace with REAL CURRENT ACTUAL China, or not? Are you being ALL INCLUSIVE of everyone from China by solely flying the Taiwanese flag? I don't think so.

Perhaps your actions in this case are even, dare I say, racist. My wife is essentially being discriminated against by the actions of your garden organizers. She's not from Taiwan, and you do claim to have a Chinese garden, right? So where's the flag for China in the Chinese garden?

Sincerely,

Jonathan

-------------------end of quote

Further request for help:

In the Peace Garden in Salt Lake (Jordan Park) there's no flag flying for the People's Republic of China. In the "Chinese garden" there's a Taiwanese flag, but the last time I checked Taiwan is not China. Would you like to help organize having a garden in our Peace Garden which either a.) represents all of China and has NO flag flying, or b.) represents the People's Republic of China, with PRC flag flying?

Can a PRC expat have pride in the country they grew up in? Sure! Why not? Taiwan is not China, nor will it ever be China, not even if the PRC becomes more democratic and open and so on. The PRC is here to stay, regardless of whether it becomes more open and free in the future or not. And Hong Kong is a good roadmap perhaps. Hong Kong is part of the PRC also, not Taiwan.

It's too bad that our so-called peace garden is being used as a political football. In our public garden there's a flag for Vietnam, Russia, and so on. Why not for the PRC? Let me know if you want to help...

Church History museum; Chinese family values; atheist & humanist groups are religions too.

Commentary on our visit to the LDS Church History Museum and to Temple Square. We saw the new Boy Scout exhibit at the museum, the golden plates, the angel Macaroni (I mean Moroni), and so on.

Built in human morality fully exists within religions, and also in less religious societies like China. How can we separate the useful facts of human morality in religion from the lies? It's hard work.

Mormonism is a modern cult - a cult in a suit and a tie. But new atheist and humanist groups are religions also - where you have lies you cannot question, and where you have to be politically correct for fear of not being a "genuine" atheist or humanist.

Religions do have some good ideas, but you wouldn't realize that unless you: a.) spent several years checking out all the hippie crap, and b.) going to gay bars & parties with your gay nephew, and c.) making note of how a convicted pedophile was gladly accepted back into your nephew's friend group after leaving prison, and d.) going to Portland and seeing what people do there via an Alice in Wonderland style journey, and e.) marrying a woman from China - where they never heard of Joseph Smith and very little of Jesus. Also making note of how your gay uncle died of AIDS leaving his regular normal family with no father will help expand your perspective. So, in spite of their bullshit, the Mormon & Catholic churches do have some very good ideas and ideals.

Why do religions have to support themselves with lies? Even the atheistic versions of religions have lies? Lies about the negative impacts of the ultra-left agenda.

The crazy ideas are mixed in with some good and useful truths. It's all integrated together. So, how can we separate out useful fact from harmful fiction? Perhaps one key way is this: refusing to be politically correct!

Maybe China is showing us the way: family values! They don't believe in Jesus or Joseph Smith, and yet they have a great deal of good valuable down home family values. They aren't perfect either, but they do value family.

But: Shhh! In atheist & humanist groups have to be very quiet about what you really think - and so such groups are religion also. So watch out!

Reject political correctness and embrace family values.

8-27-2013 7:32am