Liberal Socialist Democrats against Islam - yes we are here too

Video commentary:

Recently Geert Wilders visited Australia. What was the response? Violent protests & slander against Mr. Wilders. Funny how easy it is for Islam-apologists to throw stones, figuratively & literally against people who already have to live with round the clock security due to past & present threats from Islamists. Geert Wilders. Ayaan Hirsi Ali. Sam Harris. Danish cartoonists & editors.

Here's an article about Wilders' visit to Australia:
http://www.theglobalmail.org/feature/fact-checking-the-geert-wilders-road-show/562/

And here is my response to Eric Ellis' piece:

Ellis's article is a terribly inaccurate, prejudiced, and in my view a libel-ridden rant about Wilders. Guilt by association. Painting with a broad brush. All the things the reporter-writer may well claim to hate. Is the 'far right' in favor of leaving Islam and becoming atheistic? Are they in favor of gay or women's rights? Islamophobia? How about Scientologyphobia? Mormonphobia? Cultphobia? Or even Wildersphobia,  truthphobia, or factsphobia?

Using terms like Islamophobia, and the other abusive ad-hominem and guilt-by-claimed-association attacks in this article - it's a way of shutting the conversation down.

Should Islamic people leave Islam for atheism or maybe liberal Christianity? Would that make their lives better?

Examine the recent work of Sam Harris, and his book The Moral Landscape. In his book Harris advocates for comparing religions & world views on a scale that measures happiness & well being. Are women & men really happy if they are taught to fear human sexuality, where women are bagged from head to toe, and where young men are taught in a de facto way that the only way they can actually have a relationship with a woman is to engage in murderous jihad so that they can then have 72 virgins in the afterlife? Let's hope it's actually raisins instead of virgins. More info on that front from a former member of the Muslim Brotherhood:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pxfo11A7XuA

Islam is not a race. It never has been a race. It's a religion, a meme set, and all meme sets deserve to be evaluated on their merits.

On 9/11 no Christian or Jew or Hindu flew planes into buildings in New York. On 7/7 not even a Scientologist or a Jehovah's Witness took similar actions. Ideas matter. Doctrine matters. History matters. Facts matter. And what people actually believe matters.

So, with Eric Ellis's rather petty, dismissive, and attacking-type article, he's attempted to blow a huge amount of smoke, all in attempt to be yet another apologist for Islam. But, the terrorists speak for themselves, and their world view can be accurately pulled directly from the Quran and from modern Islamic societies where young men & women are taught to fear normal human sexuality and to hate the outsider.

In additional to Australia Europe also has problems with allowing free speech & free thought. What is the status of free speech in Europe? Both the Organization for Islamic Cooperation (an international Islamic country organization), and the European Council consider racism to include taking smack about a religion - blasphemy laws essentially.

Here's more info for your research:

Geert Wilders interviews about his Australia visit:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-l_AzeFnyw4
and:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZsUQa5m3Mf8

a speech of Wilders in Australia:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXUyD_H_mtk

related people:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayaan_Hirsi_Ali
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theo_van_Gogh_%28film_director%29

Winston Churchhill on Islam:

"How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy. The effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live. A degraded sensualism deprives this life of its grace and refinement; the next of its dignity and sanctity. The fact that in Mohammedan law every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property - either as a child, a wife, or a concubine - must delay the final extinction of slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among men. Thousands become the brave and loyal soldiers of the faith: all know how to die but the influence of the religion paralyses the social development of those who follow it. No stronger retrograde force exists in the world. Far from being moribund, Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing faith. It has already spread throughout Central Africa, raising fearless warriors at every step; and were it not that Christianity is sheltered in the strong arms of science, the science against which it had vainly struggled, the civilization of modern Europe might fall, as fell the civilization of ancient Rome."
as from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_River_War

Article responding to what happened in Australia with Wilders' visit:

Cowardly critics of Geert Wilders shame our country
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/opinion/cowardly-critics-of-geert-wilders-shame-our-country/story-e6frfhqf-1226584547791

Stephen Coughlin, Part 5: The Role of the OIC in Enforcing Islamic Law
---how the OIC considers criticism of Islam to be racisthttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JkAZUvQAzkc

More on free speech in Europe:
Elisabeth Sabaditsch-Wolff speech, European Parliament, Brussels July 9 2012
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AmTj6J1RIeo
and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERN9nWeHDE0

Michael Coren with Elisabeth Sabaditsch-Wolff
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VR4uDP1bKhA

Blasphemy laws in Austria - de facto sharia...

"...Whoever publicly a person or thing that is the object of veneration of a domestic existing church or religious society, or demeans a doctrine, a lawful custom or a lawful establishment of such a church or religious community may or ridiculed, behavior under which his is liable to arouse legitimate offense, with imprisonment up to six months or a fine of up to 360 daily rates to be punished..."

Translation of original source page:
http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=de&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jusline.at%2F188_Herabw%25C3%25BCrdigung_religi%25C3%25B6ser_Lehren_StGB.html

EU's blasphemy law...
http://europa.eu/legislation_summaries/justice_freedom_security/combating_discrimination/l33178_en.htm

And it's effects - the prosecution of Sabaditsch-Wolff & Wilders & others...
http://www.rightwinggranny.com/?tag=framework-decision-on-combating-racism-and-xenophobia
...quashing free speech about the prophet who married a 6 year old and who consummated the marriage when she was 9

Eric Allen Bell: He was working on a documentary for an Islamic mega mosque in Tennessee. Changed his mind after meeting an Egyptian Coptic Christian taxi driver and investigated Islam & Mohamed further.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZxBLJP0t03w

His website: http://www.globalone.tv/profiles/blogs/the-drain-by-eric-allen-bell
Former blog: http://www.dailykos.com/blog/EricAllenBell

Rowan Atkinson on free speech in Britain:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gciegyiLYtY

and some small progress: 'Insulting' to be dropped from section 5 of Public Order Act
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jan/14/insulting-section-5-public-order-act

We fought to save the EU countries from Hitler. But apparently they're still embracing some of his policies via outlawing the heart & roots of free speech. People in religions, particularly conservative religions like Islam & Mormonism, are in memetic prisons. Free speech is one key way to free these people, and pin headed politicians often don't understand that democracy & science & true progress depending on unhindered free speech & free though. Let there be a crucible, and let's work to get something very similar to the U.S. First Amendment enacted in the EU & elsewhere.

Other 9/11 liberals: Bill Maher, Christopher Hitchens, Salman Rushdie, & Sam Harris.

-------------

3-11 addendum:

Found the following story today:

Israel condemns Zionism comments by Turkey's PM Erdogan
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-21628757

Even Turkey wants to elevate "Islamophobia" to the status of racism or genocide.

"If you say something which either offends me or which may cause me to change my mind, I get to punish you the same way as if you physically attacked me."

And Turkey is a member of the OIC.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organisation_of_Islamic_Cooperation#Member_states
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Member_states_of_the_Organisation_of_Islamic_Cooperation
More info on the doublespeak of the OIC:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=JkAZUvQAzkc
 

atheists in Jamaica - video found

Here's a video I found regarding atheists in Jamaica:

Religious Hardtalk - Atheism and Secularism - 9-18-2012

Related website:
http://www.televisionjamaica.com/Programmes/ReligiousHardtalk.aspx/Videos/20909

Mormon meeting house visit - 2-17-2013

My wife & son & I attended part of the Mormon meeting this morning. We tried some bread and water, listened to a couple of hymns, and part of a boring wrote-recitation-style talk by some lady. My son's fussiness gave us an excuse to escape early.

We went to the same meeting house where my father's family had Christmas parties when I was young. Last weekend the monk at the Salt Lake Buddhist Temple suggested that we just go back to our first religion. So today I followed his advice & we tried out Mormonism today. The result? Same old boring stuff. Oh, and the sound was up too loud in the place. On the way out we saw pictures of the leaders. As we passed by Spencer Kimball's photo we made note of his abhorrence for certain, if not most, expressions of sexuality.
http://lds-mormon.com/worthy_letter.shtml
http://lds-mormon.com/worthy_letter1.shtml
http://www.lds.org/braille/The%20Miracle%20of%20Forgiveness.txt
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2013/02/ldsorg-discover-perversity-or-mormonism.html
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2013/02/the-violence-of-buddhism-relativism.html

diet spreadsheets - February 8-15, 2013

As an addendum to this earlier post, here's more food spreadsheets:

2-8-2013

2-9-2013

2-10-2013

2-11-2013

2-12-2013

2-13-2013

2-14-2013

2-15-2013

Discrimination again atheists in Islamic countries

Moohamed didn't like detractors. In his Quran he states:

"...4:56 Lo! Those who disbelieve Our revelations, We shall expose them to the Fire. As often as their skins are consumed We shall exchange them for fresh skins that they may taste the torment. Lo! Allah is ever Mighty, Wise..."
http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/quran/4/index.htm#56

Even today, in Islamic countries atheists are threatened with death or jailed:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discrimination_against_atheists#Islamic_countries

For example, we have the case of Alexander Aan - jailed in Indonesia for posting "God does not exist" on facebook. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Aan

Group advocating his freedom:
http://www.facebook.com/groups/307997139292825/

Lars Hedegaard - Danish journalist narrowly escapes death:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2273988/The-bullet-flew-past-ear-Danish-anti-Islam-writer-narrowly-survives-doorstep-assassination-attempt.html#axzz2KnjRINo9

A quote from Mr. Hedegaard:

“Criticism of religion is not only the starting point of all criticism. It is the prerequisite of any kind of criticism. In a society where religion cannot be criticized, everything becomes religion from the length of your beard to what hand to use when wiping your backside. Where there is no criticism of religion, life and society in their entirety become religious and the littlest squeak against the existing order is an act of blasphemy.”

Additional info:
http://www.economist.com/news/international/21567059-ex-muslim-atheists-are-becoming-more-outspoken-tolerance-still-rare-no-god-not

Info about other people persecuted by Islam - about Theo Van Gogh, Salman Rushdie, and 9/11 liberals:
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2013/01/sam-harris-on-when-crazies-get-guns.html

Preventing nutjobs from going over the edge

Regarding Chrisopher Dorner:

My familiarity with administrative hearings and the pinheads who run them leads me to believe on first glance that Dorner may have been wrongfully terminated, solely from the perspective of supposedly false statements about another officer...

Check out: http://www.leagle.com/xmlResult.aspx?xmldoc=In+CACO+20111003006.xml&docbase=CSLWAR3-2007-CURR

http://hollywood.patch.com/articles/charlie-beck-dorner-firing-will-be-reopened

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/10/us/los-angeles-police-to-reopen-dorner-case.html?_r=0

I read some of his manifesto. It sounds as if they may have shafted him, just from the perspective of what they state that he got fired for. But on the other hand most people wronged, especially cops, don't go on shooting rampages. 

His manifesto: https://sites.google.com/site/christopherjdorner/home

I wonder if he would have been treated better by the LAPD, if he could have then been helped in other ways with counseling, and stayed on. Then the people Dorner killed would still be alive? It's a worthy thought experiment to conduct, especially for people who run administrative hearings and who run police departments...

So far the guy is confirmed to have killed four people. So, in his case it's good that he's dead. But everyone should realize the part they may play in the course of actions of someone who is unstable enough to do such things. They need to be treated with more care, and not sent to the wolves, where they can act out in negative ways. They should be a.) treated fairly, and b.) guided toward necessary mental health counseling. So while Dorner is responsible for his actions, and it's good that he's dead, there is simultaneously other people who're responsible for tipping a person with a propensity for being unstable over the edge via an apparently unfairly harsh & retributive environment (at the LAPD).

the violence of Buddhism - relativism, cult of personality, ignorance, & pacifism

Video:

About our February 10th, 2013 visit to the Salt Lake Buddhist Temple.


During the service the following item was read, as from article 10 of the Japanese Seventeen Article Constitution, by Shōtoku Taishi:

Let us cease from wrath, and refrain from angry looks. Nor let us be resentful when others differ from us. For all men have hearts, and each heart has its own leanings. Their right is our wrong, and our right is their wrong. We are not unquestionably sages, nor are they unquestionably fools. Both of us are simply ordinary men. How can any one lay down a rule by which to distinguish right from wrong? For we are all, one with another, wise and foolish, like a ring which has no end. Therefore, although others give way to anger, let us on the contrary dread our own faults, and though we alone may be in the right, let us follow the multitude and act like men.

Shōtoku Taishi - authored in 604 and published in 720 CE

Also we have article 6:

Chastise that which is evil and encourage that which is good. This was the excellent rule of antiquity...

'How can any one lay down a rule by which to distinguish right from wrong?' - contrast that with the claim that we should '...Chastise that which is evil and encourage that which is good. This was the excellent rule of antiquity...' ?

Human morals come from a combination of socialization and genetics.

Additionally the preacher guy stated that people who come to his church from other religions should consider going back to their religions. How uneducated can a person be about what actually happens in other religions?

Related links:

lds.org : discover the perversity or Mormonism
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2013/02/ldsorg-discover-perversity-or-mormonism.html

Rationalism, Naturalism, Cultural Relativism, and having an accurate view of the world
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2012/12/rationalism-naturalism-cultural.html

atheist morality: response to Peter Singer, Moshe Averick: after birth abortions, infanticide, and human rights
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2013/01/atheist-morality-response-to-peter.html

Salt Lake Buddhist Temple: http://www.slbuddhist.org

Japanese 17 article constitution: http://www.duhaime.org/LawMuseum/LawArticle-1182/604-The-Seventeen-Article-Constitution-of-Japan.aspx

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seventeen-article_constitution

Criticism of Buddhism: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Buddhism

Shōtoku Taishi:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_Sh%C5%8Dtoku

http://www.buddhanet.net/nippon/nippon_partIII.html

Crazed old fart virgin decides to resign...

In response to the story here, the following comment was posted & then censored by the BBC:

Crazed old virgins have no appreciation for human nature. Mass child rape, enabled by the institutions they foster. Locking women up for being 'too pretty,' in Ireland (Magdalene asylums). These men have an abusive relationship with existence, and the institutions they lead and foster show it.

What's up BBC, is the truth too much for you? Are you willing to tell the truth? Yes, we're 'shocked,' so 'shocked' that a man who helped protect pedophiles is deciding to resign.

Everything isn't equal.

A trimmed down version was published by then later however.

In any case, who do crazed old farts get to run abusive religions?

Cults of personality, a religions run by men who exist in their own little self-supporting bubble. Everyone loves them. They have their own terminology. People who're critical on the outside are considered devils. It's all par for the course for such systems.

Related posts:

Crazed old fart virgins don't know shit - and keep them away from your children
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2012/11/crazed-old-fart-virgins-dont-know-shit.html

Evangelical & 'religious' atheism - Utah Atheist Brunch
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2013/02/evangelical-religious-atheism-utah.html

Chinese New Year 2013 - Salt Lake City

Videos and photos from the Chinese New Year celebrations at the Salt Lake City library, February 9, 2013:

Photos and videos together:

Videos only - regular version:

Videos only - stabilized version:

Recent diet spreadsheets - February 8-10, 2013

As an addendum to my earlier post about my recent diet, here's more diet spreadsheets:

2-8-2013

2-9-2013

2-10-2013

2-11-2013

Also I found the following page: How to Break a Weight Loss Plateau

On 2-12 added the sheet for 2-11.

lds.org : discover the perversity or Mormonism

lds.org : discover the perversity or Mormonism

Go to lds.org. Search for the following terms:

masturbation
necking
"petting"
fornication
atheist
atheism

Find out what these people actually think about the human condition.

Also, read the horrible book viewable at
http://web.archive.org/web/20100712035957/http://www.lds.org/braille/The%20Miracle%20of%20Forgiveness.txt
...by past Mormon prophet Spencer Kimball. While in that document do text searches for the same words.

Then in response, read the following reviews of this book:
http://www.amazon.com/The-Miracle-Forgiveness-Spencer-Kimball/product-reviews/0884944441/ref=cm_cr_pr_hist_1?ie=UTF8&filterBy=addOneStar&showViewpoints=0

More info:

My own pages:
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com
http://corvus.freeshell.org/corvus_corax/two/life_path/life_path.htm

Audio from past exmormon conferences:
http://www.exmormonfoundation.org/conference-archive.html

Also current Mormon apostle believes that atheists are all moral relativists. What a bunch of bulls#|t. Atheists are humans too.

For example check out:
https://www.lds.org/ensign/2013/02/balancing-truth-and-tolerance
where Dallin Oaks says:

"...For example, an atheist has no need to decide what kinds and occasions of profanity or blasphemy can be tolerated and what kinds should be confronted. Persons who don’t believe in God or in absolute truth in moral matters can see themselves as the most tolerant of persons. For them, almost anything goes. This belief system can tolerate almost any behavior and almost any person. Unfortunately, some who believe in moral relativism seem to have difficulty tolerating those who insist that there is a God who should be respected and that there are certain moral absolutes that should be observed..."

My response: What a shallow, obtuse, non-sequitur, and just plain wrong evaluation of what & who atheists are. We fight against abusive religions like yours because there's good reason to do so. And no, being an atheist does not automatically make one a moral relativist. I am not one, Mr. Oaks.

Sam Harris, on science helping to determine that is moral (videos found):
https://www.youtube.com/results?q=moral+landscape

Myths about atheists - Mormon & other religious leaders are especially interested in putting out lies about atheists:
http://www.samharris.org/site/full_text/10-myths-and-10-truths-about-atheism1

Dawkins on atheist morality:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4aCRHjH6d4Q

Also check out the morality in the Bible, Quran, and Book of Mormon:
http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/
http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/quran/index.htm
http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/BOM/index.htm

For each scriptural text you can find good sections about the complete lack of morality via clicking on the following terms:

Injustice

Cruelty and Violence

Intolerance

Contradictions

Science and History

Family Values

Interpretation

Misogyny

Sex

And what of the morality of Mormon leaders?

On oral sex, past Mormon prophet Spencer wants to get into your bedroom:
http://lds-mormon.com/worthy_letter.shtml
http://lds-mormon.com/worthy_letter1.shtml

On masturbation, past Mormon prophet Spencer Kimball & Mormon apostle Boyd Packer both want to have a look:
http://www.zionsbest.com/only.html
http://mormonthink.com/QUOTES/masturbation.htm

Subverting normal human sexuality: Mormon Church's principal crime
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2012/12/subverting-normal-human-sexuality.html

Joseph Smith, the founder of Mormonism, gets to have a 14 year old wife & wives who are still married to other men.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Joseph_Smith's_wives

Brigham Young, the second Mormon prophet, gets a 15 year old & wives still married to other men.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Brigham_Young's_wives

Sin and Death in Mormon Country - about the costs of shaming children about masturbation:
http://web.archive.org/web/20080620075156/http://www.affirmation.org/suicide_info/sin_and_death_in_mormon_country.shtml

Recent diet spreadsheets - February 3-7, 2013

Back around ~2005 I lost about 110 pounds. I'm back on a more regimented diet for a short while. Here's links to recent spreadsheets to show what I'm eating & my progress:

2-3-2013

2-4-2013

2-5-2013

2-6-2013

2-7-2013

Primary site used for calories per gram info:
http://www.thecaloriecounter.com

Additional key things included:

Sucralose (splenda - or store brand equivalents from any store in the yellow bags), added to the oatmeal, and also used to make sugar-free lemonade or koolaid.

Today I'll be buying more cocoa powder, which is also good to add to the oatmeal.

I'd prefer to have tuna over the protein powder, but I'm not having a lot of tuna due to mercury concerns. I found some whey based protein powder which is lower in sugar and higher in protein, which is almost as good as tuna on a calories per gram of protein basis.

Tracy Aviary visit - February 3rd, 2013

visit to Tracy Aviary, on February 3rd, 2013:

Tracy Aviary is a public birds-only zoo / aviary in Salt Lake City, Utah.

Stabilized version:

...has a closer in view as a result of the stabilization.

Evangelical & 'religious' atheism - Utah Atheist Brunch

The Salt Lake Valley Atheists group held their monthly Utah Atheist Bunch, on Sunday February 3rd, 2013. Here's a clip from that meeting, and then subsequent commentary added on from the 5th and 6th:

The talk at the meeting regarded whether atheism is a religion. At the front of his talk the speaker stated that "evangelical atheism" is just as bad as other forms of evangelical religion, and he said that atheists should not be "moral busybodies."

After his talk the speaker took a more conciliatory tone to some extent and said that he was mainly concerned about tactics. Also during his talk he said that it may be appropriate to respond to other religionists if they were procreatory.

Is atheism a religion? Not in the traditional sense. In religions usually there's leaders who cannot be questioned. Atheists tend to value science & try to reject dogma. Scientists get ahead in science by actually disproving, overturning, or adding to previous theories. Usually religious organizations reject and resist change and challenges to their core leaders & doctrines.

There is a lot of provocation going on from regligionists. Mormons send out their missionaries, they interrogate children and adults about masturbation, necking, petting, sex outside of marriage, and even oral sex in marriage. Catholic priests rape children en masse, and Catholics & conservative Anglicans have thrown their pretty women and women who had sex outside of marriage into asylums. Islamic people require that their women live in the prison of the burqa, niqab, and hijab.

More info:
My own writings including info on Islam & Mormonism:
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com
http://corvus.freeshell.org/corvus_corax/two/life_path/life_path.htm

Related info:
Sam Harris on science being able to comment on morality:
http://www.samharris.org/media/video

Scott Atran & Sam Harris debating:
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=sam+harris+scott+atran

Mormon oral sex letter:
http://lds-mormon.com/worthy_letter.shtml
http://lds-mormon.com/worthy_letter1.shtml

Catholic child rape:
http://www.bishop-accountability.org

Christians locking women up who were too pretty, or who had sex outside of marriage:
Magdalene asylums
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magdalene_asylum

Related video on the issue - Sex in a cold climate - documentary:

Tawfik Hamid on fear of sexuality in Islam:
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2013/02/happy-world-hijab-day-its-gonna-be-good.html

A link to Galileo's sentencing document, can be found on my post at
DNA, the Book of Mormon, and Creationists: blowing smoke in response to science & facts
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2013/02/dna-book-of-mormon-and-creationists.html

DNA, the Book of Mormon, and Creationists: blowing smoke in response to science & facts

Ok, so this is turning out to be a long standing issue. Examine the history of science & religion. In the past scientists got locked up for doing science, because their work challenged the contemporary views of the world. And even today, atheists are being sent to prison for speaking their mind.

Galileo was found to be "...vehemently suspect of heresy," and later sentenced to prison. A relevant excerpt from his sentence - but read the whole thing when you get a chance:

We say, pronounce, sentence, and declare that you, the above-mentioned Galileo, because of the things deduced in the trial and confessed by you as above, have rendered yourself according to this Holy Office vehemently suspected of heresy, namely of having held and believed a doctine which is false and contrary to the divine and Holy Scripture: that the sun is the center of the world and does not move from east to west, and the earth moves and is not the center of the world, and that one may hold and defend as probable an opinion after it has been declared and defined contrary to Holy Scripture.  Consequently you have incurred all the censures and penalties imposed and promulgated by the sacred canons and all particular and general laws against such delinquents.  We are willing to absolve you from them provided that first, with a sincere heart and unfeigned faith, in front of us you abjure, curse, and detest the above-mentioned errors and heresies, and every other error and heresy contrary to the Catholic and Apostolic Church, in the manner and form we will prescribe to you.
    Furthermore, so that this serious and pernicious error and transgression of yours does not remain completely unpunished, and so that you will be more cautious in the future and an example for others to abstain from similar crimes, we order that the book Dialogue by Galileo Galilei be prohibited by public edict.
    We condemn you to formal imprisonment in this Holy Office at our pleasure.  As a salutary penance we impose on you to recite the seven penitential Psalms once a week for the next three years.  And we reserve the authority to moderate, change, or condone wholly or in part the above-mentioned penalties and penances. 

And then later we have the Scopes Trial, where teaching evolution was illegal in Tennessee. 

No conflict between science & religion? That's what the Templeton Foundation would have us believe.

It almost goes without saying that creation "science" (which is not a science) is a direct response from religionists who see science as a threat.

The approach of the creationist religionists is as follows:

We don't like the answers science gives, they disprove our literalist interpretation of scripture. Therefore we shall simply redefine what science is and what science means, and we'll blow as much smoke as possible and muddy the waters with half and partial truths regarding what the true state of scientific discovery is.

This is precisely the approach taken by the "creation scientists:" blow smoke, change definitions, and lie when you have to.

And, the exact same approach is taken by the Mormon Church in the following articles, as they pathetically attempt to respond to DNA evidence refuting key claims in their founding religious documents on the origins of the American Indians. Check out:

http://maxwellinstitute.byu.edu/publications/review/?vol=15&num=2&id=507
and more fluff & articles from similar people:
http://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/dna-and-the-book-of-mormon

Appropriate responses to smoke from the Mormon Church on the issue of DNA & the Book of Mormon:

My original responses:

Mormon Doctrine: Indians are Lamanites, period, full stop.
http://corvus.freeshell.org/corvus_corax/two/life_path/lamaniteindianref.html

Where is the Lamanite DNA?
http://corvus.freeshell.org/psittacus/three/tract/dna_additional.htm

A book on the subject by Simon Southerton.
http://www.amazon.com/Losing-Lost-Tribe-Native-Americans/dp/1560851813

More info:

A talk by Dr. Southerton to at an Exmormon Foundation conference:
http://exmormonfoundation.org/audio2006.html
...look under the text on that page that says
"Simon Southerton, Ph.D.: 'Losing a Lost Race: From Radishes to DNA and Outer Darkness'"

Mormon scriptures that directly tie American Indians with Israel:

The Book of Mormon - translated by Joseph Smith from gold plates:

    2 Nephi 26:19
    19 And it shall come to pass, that those who have dwindled in unbelief shall be smitten by the hand of the Gentiles.

    Enos 1:16
    And I had faith, and I did cry unto God that he would preserve the records; and he covenanted with me that he would bring them forth unto the Lamanites in his own due time.

Doctrine & Covenants - where the Mormon God speaks directly to Joseph Smith:

    D&C 3:18
    18 And this testimony shall come to the knowledge of the Lamanites, and the Lemuelites, and the Ishmaelites, who dwindled in unbelief because of the iniquity of their fathers, whom the Lord has suffered to destroy their brethren the Nephites, because of their iniquities and their abominations.

    D&C 3:19
    19 And for this very purpose are these plates preserved, which contain these records---that the promises of the Lord might be fulfilled, which he made to his people;

    D&C 3:20
    20 And that the Lamanites might come to the knowledge of their fathers, and that they might know the promises of the Lord, and that they may believe the gospel and rely upon the merits of Jesus Christ, and be glorified through faith in his name, and that through their repentance they might be saved. Amen.

    D&C 19:27
    27 Which is my word to the Gentile, that soon it may go to the Jew, of whom the Lamanites are a remnant, that they may believe the gospel, and look not for a Messiah to come who has already come.

    D&C 28:8
    8 And now, behold, I say unto you that you shall go unto the Lamanites and preach my gospel unto them; and inasmuch as they receive thy teachings thou shalt cause my church to be established among them; and thou shalt have revelations, but write them not by way of commandment.

    D&C 32:2
    2 And that which I have appointed unto him is that he shall go with my servants, Oliver Cowdery and Peter Whitmer, Jun., into the wilderness among the Lamanites.

    D&C 54:8
    8 And thus you shall take your journey into the regions westward, unto the land of Missouri, unto the borders of the Lamanites.

    D&C Section 57 Introduction - 1986 Edition

    Revelation given through Joseph Smith the Prophet, in Zion, Jackson County, Missouri, July 20, 1831. HC 1: 189-190. In compliance with the Lord's command (Section 52), the elders had journeyed from Kirtland to Missouri with many varied experiences and some opposition. In contemplating the state of the Lamanites and the lack of civilization, refinement, and religion among the people generally, the Prophet exclaimed in yearning prayer: "When will the wilderness blossom as the rose? When will Zion be built up in her glory, and where will they Temple stand, unto which all nations shall come in the last days?" Subsequently he received this revelation.

    D&C 57:4
    4 Wherefore, it is wisdom that the land should be purchased by the saints, and also every tract lying westward, even into the line running directly between Jew and Gentile.

    [Footnote on the bottom of page 103 of the 1986 D&C:]
    4b IE by metonymy "Jew" here refers to the Lamanites, and "Gentile" to the white settlers.

...and more direct links are at
http://corvus.freeshell.org/corvus_corax/two/life_path/lamaniteindianref.html

But notice, in the Doctrine & Covenants sections referenced above, we have The Mormon God, Elohim, speaking directly to Joseph Smith, right? Hey, Mormon Church, and FARMS, can you get around that?

The Mormon Brain Software, which was running in my own brain for several years, was a set of memes that operated rather like a virus or a biological system that put up defenses.

The Devils of Mormonism Advocacy Skepticism
http://corvus.freeshell.org/corvus_corax/two/life_path/Mormon_devil.htm

...and they do in all religions. If you have a doubt, that's from Satan. So, this is the last resort of all religionists. A newer tactic is to try to redefine what science means and what science is. That's the tactic of creation "scientists" and Templeton Chumps alike. And another longer standing tactic is to blow smoke. And then, if all else fails, just threaten people with the fear that any doubt comes to them via an evil spirit. How perverse, but it's par for the course in cult-type religions.

How can we move forward, and why?

Here's a relevant talk I gave at my own mothers funeral:
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2010/12/funeral-talk-that-i-gave-in-february.html

The wackiness of Mormonism has led people to become atheists.

Here's one key example: Julia Sweeney...

and

Related blog post:

Museum of Ancient Life visit - February 2nd, 2013
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2013/02/museum-of-ancient-life-visit-february.html

Museum of Ancient Life visit - February 2nd, 2013

At the North American Museum of Ancient Life, in Lehi (near Provo), Utah (also should be known in my view as the 'Provo Dinosaur Museum'), they have a lot of nice exhibits. But one key thing missing is any mention of human evolution, or that there were other 'homo' species, such as neanderthals. What's up with that? So yes the place is nice & pretty, but they aren't telling the full story with the glaring omission of human evolution. Zero mention in the place - from what we saw. Nice & pretty to be sure, but not the full story of "ancient life." Video from our February 2nd, 2013 visit:

More info on human evolution:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_evolution

Perhaps one additional reason they don't want to delve into the topic is that DNA science & evidence proves that the Book of Mormon is a lie.

More info on that issue - from Dr. Simon Southerton - a DNA scientist and former Mormon bishop:
http://www.postmormon.org/exp_e/index.php/magazine/pmm_feature_full_text/native_american_dna/

A talk by Dr. Southerton to at an Exmormon Foundation conference:
http://exmormonfoundation.org/audio2006.html
...look under the text on that page that says
"Simon Southerton, Ph.D.: 'Losing a Lost Race: From Radishes to DNA and Outer Darkness'"

Where is the Lamanite DNA? - my own article on the subject:
http://corvus.freeshell.org/psittacus/three/tract/dna_additional.htm

Does he know where the Lamanite DNA is?

Also neither he, nor the Mormon God, was apparently aware that ancient humans had sex with neanderthals & other non-homo-sapien species:

Sex with Neanderthals and Denisovans gave healthy boost to human genome: study
http://phys.org/news/2011-08-sex-neanderthals-denisovans-gave-healthy.html

The downside of sex with Neanderthals
http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/blog/2011/aug/25/neanderthal-denisovan-genes-human-immunity

Now-Extinct Relative Had Sex with Humans Far and Wide
http://www.livescience.com/16171-denisovans-humans-widespread-sex-asia.html

Neanderthal genes 'survive in us'
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/8660940.stm
relevant image from article:

Related blog post:

DNA, the Book of Mormon, and Creationists: blowing smoke in response to science & facts
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2013/02/dna-book-of-mormon-and-creationists.html

Park City during Sundance, and Utah Museum of Contemporary Art in Salt Lake - January 26, 2013

Visits to Park City during Sundance, and then to the Utah Museum of Contemporary Art - January 26, 2013

Park City during Sundance - Park City, Utah - Sundance Film Festival:

Utah Museum of Contemporary Art (in Salt Lake) - formerly known as the Salt Lake Art Center, next to the Salt Palace in Salt Lake City, Utah:

Happy World Hijab Day! It's gonna be a good one.

Hey. Guess what? It's World Hijab Day!

News about the issue:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-21283301

And a very appropriate response:

https://web.archive.org/web/20160709130948/http://freethoughtblogs.com/maryamnamazie/2013/02/01/world-hejab-day/

From Maryam Namazie:

"What next?

Maybe we can all try to mutilate our daughters on World Mutilation Day or marry off our girls on World Child Marriages Day? How about a day when our male guardians can track our whereabouts to make sure we aren’t leaving the country.

I know adult women have a right to wear the hijab (given the threats and compulsory nature of it in most places – this is very often just a formality but nonetheless) but to ask others to wear it is a tad absurd – if I’m being polite.

I am sorry but I don’t think I am the cause of fitna/chaos in the world and therefore find the veil abhorrent.

So here is my tribute to the hijab..."

Click here for the original article. The above image comes from there.

Videos with Maryam:
https://www.youtube.com/results?q=Maryam+Namazie

Here's a related video by Tawfik Hamid:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pxfo11A7XuA -- about how sexual repression in Islamic cultures has bad effects on men & women.


-----------------------------------------------------

February 2nd addendum:

I found a discussion board on the issue, where UK soldiers seem to hang out:
http://www.arrse.co.uk/naafi-bar/193904-world-hijab-day-2.html

And also check out where some Islamists are chatting about the issue:
http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/showthread.php?101696-Feb-1st-World-Hijab-Day

Here's a relevant quote from the second site:

"...Islam and muslims have a hugh PR problem in the West. We need to help non muslims understand our religion and Islamic culture. Seriously, you need to think of it as a form of dawah..."

Indeed, and World Hijab Day isn't helping our view of your religion.

options in Utah for meeting with secular advocates

Here's info on local atheist groups in & near Salt Lake:

Salt Lake Valley Atheists. Meets the 1st Sunday at Sizzler on 4th South at 11:30AM. Kirk Robinson is the speaker this month. Eat if you wish, but it's not required. Come to the back room. For more info: http://nowscape.com/a

Many attendees are exmos. The group is purposefully politically liberal for what it's worth.

Another group, Atheists of Utah, has coffee chats every Thursday. More info on that:
http://www.facebook.com/groups/atheistsofutah/
or
http://www.meetup.com/aofuslc/#calendar

Atheists of Utah is a 501C3 type group and so is "officially" politically neutral, but attendees can have whatever views they wish & debate & discuss freely. The coffee chats tend to be a churning type of experience, and they can be fun if you decide to simply talk to your neighbor. Location Mestizo's Coffeehouse, 7-9:30PM. More info on the website.

The above groups, and this group, are members of UCOR, the Utah Coalition of Reason. http://reasonutah.org/

The yearly Exmormon Foundation conferences in Salt Lake have never had a "Christian" agenda per se - mostly a secular one of learning to live life after being in the circle of the cult. http://www.exmormonfoundation.org/

There are two Unitarian Universalist congratulations in the Salt Lake valley and some former mos attend. My own personal satisfaction level with each congregation has varied & wavered over time. From a cultural perspective the meetings & layout are more similar to Catholic & Anglican services rather than Mormon. The kids are, for example, sent away to rooms instead of being allowed to stay with their parents. Also they tend to have a paid preacher - who does admittedly tend to be very socially liberal, but still it's usually the same person speaking every week. The UU's in general have some taboos about being truly honest about he problems with religion though, and so sadly they have their heads in the sand as much as other religions to some extent. But nevertheless they are a socializing option you could consider if you wish. My further concerns about UUism: http://tinyurl.com/beqls4b

There is one or two decidedly "Christian" exmo groups locally.
Example: http://www.meetup.com/Salt-Lake-City-Ex-Mormon-Meetup

My view on such things is that people are unfortunately jumping from one cult to another. That's my view, and I won't belong to any group that would seek to censor my trying to speak my mind. I try not to be a cultural relativist, so I could say "if that what floats your boat, so be it" but I won't because doing so makes me feel bad.

Here again is a more full list of groups that ARE stronger advocates for secularism and the fruits of the Enlightenment: http://reasonutah.org/groups/

Try them all - as on that site. And don't forget that in some there is a weekly or monthly churning. So if irritating people show up one week, maybe next time you'll find more interesting people - or you could be the interesting person yourself.