Ok regarding meme sets called cults, I've been a member of more than one:
1st: The Mormon meme set. Still a cult, with a slow trajectory toward being less cult like. Founded by two polygamists who had a.) underage wives (this is called: pedophilia & child rape), and b.) wives who were still married to other men (this is called: adultery).
The Mo Church dumped polygamy, which was good, but splinter groups who also worship Joseph Smith continue the practice. I've toured first hand polygamous cities in & near Utah. And we've been bowling next to a gaggle of polygamous women & a few of their kids. I also see them at grocery stores near me on occasion. Splinter group Mormons.
In more recent years the Mo Church decided to micro-manage the sex lives of their members. In 1982 Prophet of God Spencer Kimball issued a directive stating that oral sex was not approved of god. Think about the content and procedure of such a letter going out to Mormon members. Consider very carfully the impact on the lives of regular people of such a directive.
Next Spencer Kimball told the youth of the church that masturbation could easily turn them into homosexuals. He also stated that >mandatory< interviews regarding masturbation were >required< with Mormon bishops. Such interviews were also common at the Mormon Missionary Training Center.
Consider very carefully the impact on people's lives of such misinformation & abuse.
Now, Kimball's lying abusive book Miracle of Forgiveness (oxymoron title) was recently removed from the Mo church distribution centers, after being present there in multiple languages. This happened with the past 5 years or so. But before about 5 years ago, this crap book was again in multiple languages, and given to young people & adults as required reading: https://archive.org/stream/MiracleOfForgiveness/MoF_djvu.txt
So, the dumping of Miracle of Forgiveness from the Mo Church distribution centers (the stores members go to buy religious study materials directly from the church), well that's a move in the non-cult direction.
But, and this is a huge point, the interrogations of young people & adults regarding sexual matters continues. Thus, still a cult.
If you question the leaders you are blocked from access to the temples of the church, and you might be put in trial and booted from the church. Thus, still a cult.
Some members will still threaten you personally if you publicly question church teachings and church leadership. Thus, still a cult.
There is still incredibly strong social pressure to >never< question what the top leaders say. Thus, still a cult.
2nd: The cult of cultural leftism, which I much later leaned results from cultural neomarxist postmodernism. The cultural left denies science & reason & evidence & human nature every day & all the time.
Was Margaret Sanger a eugenicist? Yes she was.
Do children absolutely require, for their own well being, a mother AND a father? Yes, for concrete and proven evolutionary reasons.
Does the birth control pill alter, in bad and dangerous ways, the mental health and mate preferences of human females? Yes.
Should a mother, ideally and if at all possible, stay home with her children for as long as possible, for the best well being of the children? Yes.
Are women paid less than men for equal work? No.
Is there systemic racism in America? No, and there's hasn't been any such for many years now.
Are humans a gender binary species? Yes.
Is capitalism & full free speech the best ways for humans to thrive best? Yes.
Did Karl Marx fundamentally misunderstand human nature? Yes. Do all socialist / communist / Marxist systems eventually fail? Yes. Are they human spirit destroying Ponzi schemes? Yes.
Is monogamy the best way for humans to mate & have kids, a system which is best both for female & male & children well being? Yes.
Do religions couch evolved morality & evolved traits? Yes.
What are the leftist answers to all the above? Pretty much exactly the opposite of what the facts & our own evolved natures show. Thus on point after point, the cultural left, is a fraking cult.
Masturbation doesn't make you a homosexual as was claimed by Spencer Kimball, although telling kids it easily can or will does unfortunately generate many ultra-leftist angry reactionaries who end up in the other-cult known as Stonewall & "Pride." But, when you're of dating age and especially when above the age of 21, directing your sexual energies toward inherent reproduction is a strategy for success.
I spent many years as an ultra-leftist reactionary. A ping pong game from ultra-right to ultra-left. From one cult to another.
A few of my nephews & nieces (and an uncle) weren't unscathed from the abuses of the ultra-left. And frankly those who were hobbled (& killed) were victims of BOTH the ultra-right AND the ultra-left. A reactionary pingpong game.
Yes people deserve to know the truth. Are you being held back by entrenched dogma & doctrines? A dogma is a premise which cannot be questioned by definition.
Yes we can question whether cultural neomarxist postmodernism is a cult and comprises a set of lies or not. Yes we can question human nature. We can question whether scientific propositions are true or not.
Joseph Smith was a charlatan, but there's a great deal of charlatanry going on on the cultural left also, charlatanry with far wider abusive scope than the influence of the itty bitty religion of Mormonism.
Showing posts with label Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter-day Saints. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter-day Saints. Show all posts
Wednesday, May 30, 2018
Thursday, June 12, 2014
The Mormon Church is not pro-family. | The old farts cannot stop us! | Moving forward.
Quotes from the Church of the Fridge
Under the Pretense of Love
"Yesterday the NY Times reported the purge of three notable voices who spoke out on real Mormon Issues from within the LDS church. John Dehlin of Mormon Stories, Kate Kelly, founder of the Ordain Women Movement, and Alan Rock Waterman of Pure Mormonism were delivered letters summoning them to church disciplinary councils where they are to be tried for apostasy. The news hit me harder than I expected it would. I have not met any of these people. But I know intimately the emotions they are facing in this moment..."
----end of quote
http://churchofthefridge.com/blog/2014/06/12/under-the-pretense-of-love/
Tearing families apart, while claiming you're trying to help them be together forever.
Directly putting a wedge between husband and wife, when one or the other aren't in.
Agreed. The Church is not about love. It's about control, hate, and money, and using the great & huge lie of "we love you" as a primary means of control.
Hearing that shit like this happens today reminds me that the cancer known as Mormonism is still fully alive. The old farts can still pull the levers.
The Mormon Church is not pro-family. Not fully. Not honestly. Yes families are produced. But they're families split right down the middle.
Attention Spencer Kimball, many of my nieces & nephews are out & free. Attention Boyd Packer, you couldn't keep us in. Our little factories are none of your fucking business. Attention, all the old farts at
https://www.lds.org/church/leaders?lang=eng
... you will not hold us down. Not any longer. The net has made us free. Excommunicate a thousand people, and you won't stop us. Our brains, bodies, and souls are no longer yours to command, nor control, nor abuse.
------
Initial exit journal created when I was more leftist, in response to being in recovery from the ultra-right:
http://corvus.freeshell.org/corvus_corax/two/life_path/life_path.htm#history
Subsequently moved more toward the middle, after "recovery from recovery:" Also after finally starting a family, and meeting a socially conservative atheist woman from a completely non-Biblical culture.
Families Can Be Together Forever... Through Evolution!
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2013/08/families-can-be-together-forever.html
Under the Pretense of Love
"Yesterday the NY Times reported the purge of three notable voices who spoke out on real Mormon Issues from within the LDS church. John Dehlin of Mormon Stories, Kate Kelly, founder of the Ordain Women Movement, and Alan Rock Waterman of Pure Mormonism were delivered letters summoning them to church disciplinary councils where they are to be tried for apostasy. The news hit me harder than I expected it would. I have not met any of these people. But I know intimately the emotions they are facing in this moment..."
----end of quote
http://churchofthefridge.com/blog/2014/06/12/under-the-pretense-of-love/
Tearing families apart, while claiming you're trying to help them be together forever.
Directly putting a wedge between husband and wife, when one or the other aren't in.
Agreed. The Church is not about love. It's about control, hate, and money, and using the great & huge lie of "we love you" as a primary means of control.
Hearing that shit like this happens today reminds me that the cancer known as Mormonism is still fully alive. The old farts can still pull the levers.
The Mormon Church is not pro-family. Not fully. Not honestly. Yes families are produced. But they're families split right down the middle.
Attention Spencer Kimball, many of my nieces & nephews are out & free. Attention Boyd Packer, you couldn't keep us in. Our little factories are none of your fucking business. Attention, all the old farts at
https://www.lds.org/church/leaders?lang=eng
... you will not hold us down. Not any longer. The net has made us free. Excommunicate a thousand people, and you won't stop us. Our brains, bodies, and souls are no longer yours to command, nor control, nor abuse.
------
Initial exit journal created when I was more leftist, in response to being in recovery from the ultra-right:
http://corvus.freeshell.org/corvus_corax/two/life_path/life_path.htm#history
Subsequently moved more toward the middle, after "recovery from recovery:" Also after finally starting a family, and meeting a socially conservative atheist woman from a completely non-Biblical culture.
Families Can Be Together Forever... Through Evolution!
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2013/08/families-can-be-together-forever.html
Thursday, April 24, 2014
On Mormons who believe science shows the Book of Mormon is true.
Mormons who believe science shows the Book of Mormon is true. There's comparisons with creationist "science" to be sure.
13th International Book of Mormon Evidence Conference
http://events.r20.constantcontact.com/register/event?oeidk=a07e8ygft4b73fe4785&llr=z7h5t5cab
The FIRM foundation:
http://firmlds.org
BoM DNA evidence:
http://www.bookofmormonevidence.org/downloads.php
An appropriate response, from a past associate of mine Simon Southerton:
http://simonsoutherton.blogspot.com/2011/12/origin-of-x-lineage.html
and
http://simonsoutherton.blogspot.com/2013/11/meldrums-x-lineage-ugly.html
It's not surprising really, to have Mormons frantically searching, searching, and searching for evidence. And then, they pull it right out of their collective asses.
The competition for the brain washed conference:
http://exmormonfoundation.org/conference-archive.html
and where Simon spoke:
http://exmormonfoundation.org/audio2006.html
Sadly the pro-science competition doesn't allow children at their conference though - STRANGE!
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/search/label/exmormon%20foundation
But they're better than nothing I suppose.
13th International Book of Mormon Evidence Conference
http://events.r20.constantcontact.com/register/event?oeidk=a07e8ygft4b73fe4785&llr=z7h5t5cab
The FIRM foundation:
http://firmlds.org
BoM DNA evidence:
http://www.bookofmormonevidence.org/downloads.php
An appropriate response, from a past associate of mine Simon Southerton:
http://simonsoutherton.blogspot.com/2011/12/origin-of-x-lineage.html
and
http://simonsoutherton.blogspot.com/2013/11/meldrums-x-lineage-ugly.html
It's not surprising really, to have Mormons frantically searching, searching, and searching for evidence. And then, they pull it right out of their collective asses.
The competition for the brain washed conference:
http://exmormonfoundation.org/conference-archive.html
and where Simon spoke:
http://exmormonfoundation.org/audio2006.html
Sadly the pro-science competition doesn't allow children at their conference though - STRANGE!
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/search/label/exmormon%20foundation
But they're better than nothing I suppose.
Tuesday, April 22, 2014
Response to a brainwashed Mormon woman from Oregon
On Facebook I found a post by a current Mormon who lives in Oregon. Below I've drafted her questions & my responses. The text next to the Q for question items is her text. And my responses are next to the A for answers.
---
Howdy.
Your profile doesn't look like a one-off troll type account, and so I'm going to respond in more detail:
Q. Why is it so important for non LDS people to tear down the LDS religion?
A. Normally when people act in this regard it's for reasons they feel are good & valuable.
A. Are you sure? Atheists tend to know the most about religion.
A. What a person believes in makes a difference. Not all beliefs have equal value. Some beliefs hurt people & destroy lives.
Q. belief in something is better than belief in nothing.
A. We don't believe in "nothing." We just don't believe in Joseph Smith's alien Kolobite god.
A. Abusive controlling brain washing iron fisted destructive religions should be for no one, ideally.
Q. should remain a personal choice.
A. Children cannot choose. Most children are sucked into the religion of their parents. They don't have the ability to choose. Even adults can be sucked in though.
A. A non-believer is no longer in the religion.
Q. then you have no right to tear it down.
A. We have EVERY RIGHT (!!!) to speak our mind, and we shall continue to do so. It is a terrible offense and abuse to request that we do otherwise.
A. When a church leader acts as as an instrument of abuse (which they do by default), is that their choice?
A. Yes it does. What else would? History, or revisionist-history? Facts, or just faith-promoting-pseudo-facts? The real life experiences of people, or just those interpreted in a way to never criticize the Mormon Church or it's leaders?
Q. It just makes it wrong for you as an individual.
A. No, not everything is equal. Not everything is relative. Not all churches are of equal value. Not all churches help and/or hurt their followers in the same way.
Q. I am an active member and devout in my beliefs
A. Which is exactly why you're saying what you're saying. Meme set defense mechanisms. Amazing, but very sad. Mormon Brain Software. Yes, I had similar software running in my brain, and I'm quite familiar with how it works. The Church is always right, everything else be damned. Joseph the charismatic charlatan has shown you the way.
Q. It was the right choice for me and my children
A. You are actively abusing your children by allowing them to remain within Mormonism.
Q. and we are happy.
A. Happy in the gilded cage?
A. We know it isn't. 8 year olds at fast & testimony meeting, and their brain washed parents, know it is.
Q. No one really knows if there is an afterlife.
A. There isn't.
Q. My chosen religion has made me a better person
A. You don't sound like a better person so far.
Q. and has given me a standard in which to live my life.
A. Your standard for living should not come from old farts who want to get your money & keep you down. Humans have built-in morality, instilled by evolution by natural selection, and by the "neck-top" apps given by culture.
A. The peace that comes from ignorance. The peace that comes from ignoring the pain of others. The peace the comes from putting your head in the sand. The peace that comes from letting your children be grilled about masturbation, and putting your children's genitals into the hands of fucking old abusive farts. The peace that comes from forcibly excluding others. The peace that comes from being a cult follower.
Q. Just because you have chosen not to believe doesn't mean the religion is wrong,
A. Are your beliefs falsifiable? If not your brain might be in a box. You need to let it out. Science shows us the way: Criticism & skepticism in the first instance. And then later truth & fact finding after cogent theory development, testing, peer review, and so on. But being willing to trash the ideas of your fellows, in good faith, all in an attempt to find out where the actual truth lies. Are you doing that now? No. Yes your religion is wrong.
Q. or that Joseph Smith (my ancestor) was a bad man.
A. OMG. Were I still a Mormon, I would now be in awe of you.
A. No it ain't.
A. Less educated people in Mexico & South America are more easily sucked in.
Q. so there must be something to it.
A. Yes there is. Amway on steroids. A cult. A sink. A whirlpool.
A. I don't really know why you keep saying choice. Choice this. Choice that.
A. What's best for us is to do exactly what we're doing now.
A. It's bad for you even if you think it's good.
A. Bash away. They need some bashing. Child raping priests? Sounds like a good reason to bash. Have at it!
Q. I have seen no evidence worth my time
A. It was worth your time to write. Is it worth your time to read the responses? If it's not, don't bother complaining in the first place.
Q. I do believe in the church and our prophets, the apostles and the corum of the 70.
A. It's spelled quorum.
A. More examples of your abused-status.
Q. All that evidence you talk about is made up and false.
A. More evidence of your being in a cult.
Q. This is a life style for active members, not a hobby or just something we do on Sundays.
A. We know damn well what life is like in the Mormon Church.
Q. We cannot be swayed by false propaganda and 'evidence' written by angry inactives or non-members.
A. More evidence that you're not a nice, happy, or healthy person.
If you want to have a dialogue with people who've left, you can have one, you can have a conversation. But NO we won't shut up at your request. We WON'T stop speaking. We WON'T stop calling out problems with the church of our youth. We WON'T stop trying to free people from the abuse - and that includes trying to free YOU from it.
Sincerely,
Jonathan
April 22, 2014
p.s. Regarding the process of science & how it works:
"Trashing" & "tear down" might imply that everything's up for grabs when it isn't. Yes it's the goal of all reasonable honest scientists to try to "tear down" existing theories. To disprove them. To show where they're wrong. But more often than not one theory builds upon another. Einstein's theories didn't destroy Newton's. It simply built upon the previous theory, showed where Newton's claims remain valid (for most of human experience & speeds & viewpoints), and where they fall apart (eg: close to the speed of light or when next to very massive objects). Same goes for other new theories, usually. But when a bigger part of a theory is overturned, we view that with joy, not concern. Cha-ching - we've now learned MORE about the Universe. Super!
The truth finding method of science is far more powerful because of this. Far more accurate results than other methods.
In science you get ahead by disproving or finding flaws with previous theories - and that is it's power.
Related article by Steven Pinker:
---
Howdy.
Your profile doesn't look like a one-off troll type account, and so I'm going to respond in more detail:
Q. Why is it so important for non LDS people to tear down the LDS religion?
A. Normally when people act in this regard it's for reasons they feel are good & valuable.
There is a substantial difference between the Evangelical protestors outside of the Great & Spacious Building & Temple Square during Mo. Conference, and why we wish to "tear down the LDS religion."Q. I don't see anyone trying to do this with any other religion.
I also don't put much stock in people who're unhappy with Mormonism because the Mormon Jesus is different from the Baptist or Protestant or Catholic Jesuses. I could care less about such differences.
However there are many valuable, good, reasonable, valid, cogent, evidence-based, experience-based, fact-based reasons we can give as to why we express concerns, and why we use the tonalities we use as we express our concerns.
Do you REALLY want to know the answer, or are you just claiming there CAN BE NO answer which contradicts the validity of Mormonism? If your approach is the latter, then there's not much use in proceeding further. However if you really want to know the answer, here's where to find out more:
1. My own exit journal: http://corvus.freeshell.org/corvus_corax/two/life_path/life_path.htm#history
2. The exit journals of hundreds of others:
http://www.exmormon.org/stories.htm
3. Specific exit journals by others I find particularly valuable:
Simon Southerton - http://www.exmormon.org/whylft125.htm
audio form his speech during his 2006 appearance at an exmo conference:
http://www.exmormonfoundation.org/audio2006.html
Additional conference audio files: http://www.exmormonfoundation.org/conference-archive.html
A. Are you sure? Atheists tend to know the most about religion.
http://articles.latimes.com/2010/sep/28/nation/la-na-religion-survey-20100928Q. Belief is belief
http://bigthink.com/videos/reading-the-bible-or-the-koran-or-the-torah-will-make-you-an-atheist
Scientology criticism: http://www.xenu.net/
JW recovery: http://www.watchtowerdocuments.com/jw-sites.html
Unitarian Univeralist recovery: http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2013/01/the-new-creed-of-unitarian-universalism.html
Catholic: http://bishop-accountability.org/
Islam: http://ex-muslim.org.uk
A. What a person believes in makes a difference. Not all beliefs have equal value. Some beliefs hurt people & destroy lives.
Q. belief in something is better than belief in nothing.
A. We don't believe in "nothing." We just don't believe in Joseph Smith's alien Kolobite god.
http://corvus.freeshell.org/psittacus/three/tract/kolob_tract.htmQ. Like all religions it is not for everyone
A. Abusive controlling brain washing iron fisted destructive religions should be for no one, ideally.
Q. should remain a personal choice.
A. Children cannot choose. Most children are sucked into the religion of their parents. They don't have the ability to choose. Even adults can be sucked in though.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_JonesQ. If you make the choice to remain a non believer in the LDS religion
A. A non-believer is no longer in the religion.
Q. then you have no right to tear it down.
A. We have EVERY RIGHT (!!!) to speak our mind, and we shall continue to do so. It is a terrible offense and abuse to request that we do otherwise.
Your church did this (among MANY other abuses):Q. If you are an inactive member due to some wrong you think you suffered then that is also your choice.
http://web.archive.org/web/20131021180407/http://www.affirmation.org/suicide_info/sin_and_death_in_mormon_country.shtml
"On March 2, 1982, Kip Eliason, age 16, distraught and filled with self-hate over his inability to stop masturbating, committed suicide..."
Good job there, Mrs. Mormon. Good job, Spencer Kimball, Boyd Packer, and parents like you (presumably). You helped Kip stop playing with his "little factory" such that he felt it necessary to kill himself.
More appropriate responses:
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/search/label/boyd%20packer
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/search/label/Spencer%20Kimball
Yes, they couldn't keep their Jesus off my penis. But, there's many other abuses that happen.
Abuses of power. Telling members they cannot question the leaders, and if they do they'll be kicked out. Being kicked out may also be turned out onto the street from your family. Complete exclusion from your own family. And even for more "nice" Mormons it will still mean exclusion from temple marriage ceremonies & other things.
PART-Member family. PART, part, part, part, member family. Which "part" is the good part and which part is the evil part? Which part is the good wing, and which part is the damaged wing that one would be better off cutting off? Member. Non-member. Apostate. Enemy of the Church. And so on.
These are ALL expressions of OUT GROUP morality. Not nice. Not good. Yes fully natural. But best worth discouraging where possible.
Thank goodness for the Internet for increasing all the scope of all of our in-group morality. The 'net is hurting Mormonism & other expressions of destructive out-group morality - and that's a good thing.
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2012/12/genocide-in-bible-ingroup-outgroup.html
http://edge.org/conversation/mc2011-history-violence-pinker
A. When a church leader acts as as an instrument of abuse (which they do by default), is that their choice?
When Joseph Smith slept with a 14 year old & with the wives of other men, was it his choice? Or is it only an even-choice when someone decides they don't like the abuse? A choice that can be easily discounted?Q. It doesn't make the religion wrong
Yes, people use their brains to make decisions. To get away from the abusers, the cult, the brain washing, the control, and to be more free. And that's a good thing.
A. Yes it does. What else would? History, or revisionist-history? Facts, or just faith-promoting-pseudo-facts? The real life experiences of people, or just those interpreted in a way to never criticize the Mormon Church or it's leaders?
Q. It just makes it wrong for you as an individual.
A. No, not everything is equal. Not everything is relative. Not all churches are of equal value. Not all churches help and/or hurt their followers in the same way.
Q. I am an active member and devout in my beliefs
A. Which is exactly why you're saying what you're saying. Meme set defense mechanisms. Amazing, but very sad. Mormon Brain Software. Yes, I had similar software running in my brain, and I'm quite familiar with how it works. The Church is always right, everything else be damned. Joseph the charismatic charlatan has shown you the way.
Q. It was the right choice for me and my children
A. You are actively abusing your children by allowing them to remain within Mormonism.
Q. and we are happy.
A. Happy in the gilded cage?
Happy in the black & white world of Pleasantville, or the color version? Happy in the dream world of all-encompassing all-encircling Mormonism, or in the real world of reality? Is ignorance bliss? It can be for a time. But in the long term being forcibly ignorant keeps a person's brain & soul in a type of prison.Q. No one really knows if religion is true.
http://matrix.wikia.com/wiki/Redpill
A. We know it isn't. 8 year olds at fast & testimony meeting, and their brain washed parents, know it is.
Q. No one really knows if there is an afterlife.
A. There isn't.
Q. My chosen religion has made me a better person
A. You don't sound like a better person so far.
Q. and has given me a standard in which to live my life.
A. Your standard for living should not come from old farts who want to get your money & keep you down. Humans have built-in morality, instilled by evolution by natural selection, and by the "neck-top" apps given by culture.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Blank_Slate
http://www.ted.com/talks/steven_pinker_chalks_it_up_to_the_blank_slate
your neck-top: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Q_mY54hjM0Q. I have peace in it.
and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sXvldBqYjGM
A. The peace that comes from ignorance. The peace that comes from ignoring the pain of others. The peace the comes from putting your head in the sand. The peace that comes from letting your children be grilled about masturbation, and putting your children's genitals into the hands of fucking old abusive farts. The peace that comes from forcibly excluding others. The peace that comes from being a cult follower.
Q. Just because you have chosen not to believe doesn't mean the religion is wrong,
A. Are your beliefs falsifiable? If not your brain might be in a box. You need to let it out. Science shows us the way: Criticism & skepticism in the first instance. And then later truth & fact finding after cogent theory development, testing, peer review, and so on. But being willing to trash the ideas of your fellows, in good faith, all in an attempt to find out where the actual truth lies. Are you doing that now? No. Yes your religion is wrong.
Q. or that Joseph Smith (my ancestor) was a bad man.
A. OMG. Were I still a Mormon, I would now be in awe of you.
The progeny of JS has spoken, and is here before us. If you were a man you might be a G.A. today. But because you don't have a penis you're pretty much excluded from any real leadership roles. Damn. If you have some male children maybe they've got a chance.Q. It is the fastest growing religion in the world
Does a bad man sleep with a 14 year old and with the wives of other men?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Joseph_Smith%27s_wives
http://www.wivesofjosephsmith.org/
A. No it ain't.
http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2012/10/09/survey-one-in-five-americans-is-religiously-unaffiliated/?hpt=hp_c1Q. in the Hispanic population
"...The fastest growing 'religious' group in America is made up of people with no religion at all..."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claims_to_be_the_fastest-growing_religion#Overall_statistics
Damn. Looks like atheism or Islam, depending on which column you choose.
A. Less educated people in Mexico & South America are more easily sucked in.
Q. so there must be something to it.
A. Yes there is. Amway on steroids. A cult. A sink. A whirlpool.
Religion is a natural phenomenon:Q. See it for what it is.......A CHOICE
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breaking_the_Spell:_Religion_as_a_Natural_Phenomenon
A. I don't really know why you keep saying choice. Choice this. Choice that.
You don't seem to understand the subtleties or realities of how the human brain works. A brain can be sucked in and held down. When a brain is in Mormonism it engages in meme-set defense & maintenance activities. There's a lot less choice in this process.Q. The ones who feel damaged and destroyed can go their own way and figure out what is best for them.
While I do believe & maintain we have free will, I can see where Sam Harris is coming from:
Sam Harris's view on free will:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_FanhvXO9Pk
Daniel Dennett's response:
http://www.naturalism.org/Dennett_reflections_on_Harris%27s_Free_Will.pdf
or http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/reflections-on-free-will
Harris's response to Dennett's review:
http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/the-marionettes-lament
In any case we have more free will that a petunia or a carrot. Our neural networks are incredibly complex computers which has far more decision-making power than other animals. But we are animals, and built-in traits & proclivities have far more of an influence than many would like to admit.
Humans can be sucked into cults. They are sucked into cults. Children are sucked into the religions of their parents. If a child's parents believe in an abusive religion, then they will probably grow up and become an abuser themselves - unless they come to their senses as they become more psychologically adult, or if they're exposed to enough evidence (personal or otherwise) which finally dislodges them from the abusive-religion meme set.
A. What's best for us is to do exactly what we're doing now.
Trying to help educate people like you about the problems with the cult you're in. Your brain & body have been hijacked, as have the brains & bodies of your children.Q. That doesn't mean it isn't good for those of us the religion is working for.
Here's a quote from a post I made back in 2012,
at http://www.postmormon.org/exp_e/index.php/discussions/adorations_index.html/viewthread/35772/#561941
Recently I discovered that Miracle of Forgiveness is available at the mobot distribution centers, in several different languages. In each language section they have the BOM, maybe a bible, but always this POS book.----------end of quote
http://www.lds.org/braille/The Miracle of Forgiveness.txt
Very appropriate responses to this book can be found in the form of one star reviews at Amazon.com:
http://www.amazon.com/The-Miracle-of-Forgiveness-ebook/product-reviews/B002JQK1VG/ref=cm_cr_pr_hist_1?ie=UTF8&filterBy=addOneStar&showViewpoints=0
Since the Mormon Church apparently considers this book to still be highly relevant, then every despicable thing Spencer Kimball & Boyd Packer have done relative to negative portrayals of human sexuality to the youth & adults in the church is relevant also.
On oral sex, Spencer wants to get into your bedroom:
http://lds-mormon.com/worthy_letter.shtml
http://lds-mormon.com/worthy_letter1.shtml
On masturbation, Spencer & Boyd both want to have a look:
http://www.zionsbest.com/only.html
http://mormonthink.com/QUOTES/masturbation.htm
Also Spencer really is concerned about "petting" and "heavy petting." Oh my, that f-ing old fart must really have been hyperventilating when he wrote his Miracle of Forgiveness book. Necking. Petting. Heavy Petting. Tell us more Spencer, about all the things you dream about at night but also hate yourself for thinking of.
But people say he was such a nice man. My father has said this, as did my mother who worked as a nurse in the COB. But the guy was really not so nice after all, after you read all hateful the trash he put out.
Here's a related blog post:
Subverting normal human sexuality: Mormon Church's principal crime
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2012/12/subverting-normal-human-sexuality.html
Anyway, with my new wife seeing the pretty white shirts and the pretty buildings, and with my more recent research into the issue of Kimball's trash book being widely promoted in different languages by the mobot church, I decided to put on youtube a reprise of a song I created some time ago:
We were all just sperm in god's balls, a parody of the song Seeds:
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2012/12/we-were-all-just-sperm-in-gods-balls.html
And, with Joseph Smith's nutty view of heaven in the form of Kolob, and "Kobol" entering the common consciousness in the form of the much less campy newer Battlestar Galatica version, the following newer song came out of a recent morning shower singing session:
Launch a Mission to Kolob...
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2012/12/launch-mission-to-kolob-and-blow-place.html
Joseph gets to have a 14 year old wife & wives who are still married to other men.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Joseph_Smith's_wives
Brigham gets a 15 year old & wives still married to other men.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Brigham_Young's_wives
But, Spencer & Boyd really were/are obsessed with that you and your children are up to at home, at night, in the privacy of your bedrooms. What's up with that? And since Spencer's piece of trash book is *very* relevant for the Mormon Church, as per their having it readily available in many different languages at their distribution centers, (and reportedly since it's required reading for new missionaries) it's clear that they are still very interested in transmitting this human spirit destroying set of memes onto everyone they can.
What is up with the Mormon Church & sex? Their horn dog founder created a religion whose god, apparently, has to have an orgasm every 4.6 minutes to create 107 billion people in one million years.
107 billion people may have lived on Earth so far:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2097038/Are-really-people-alive-today-lived-Earth.html
...and that number doesn't account for "worlds without end."
Perhaps the Mormon God is rather like a giant space termite:
http://www.termite.com/images/queenking.jpg
...that would be more fitting.
Is your god an alien?
http://corvus.freeshell.org/psittacus/three/tract/kolob_tract.htm
...and yet, now they want to very much control even the mere thought of sex in their members. Why? Because once a person actually allows themselves to be open to the possibility of sex being fun, normal, natural, empowering, and liberating, they can more easily find they have no use for the Mormon God or for the supposedly good feelings you get during Mormon Church meetings or from reading the lies of Joseph in the form of the Mormon scriptures.
The Mormon Church tries to hijack people's basic emotions, and to subvert & control & misinterpret them for their own nefarious ends. Other conservative religions do this also.
In any case I get much better feelings of validation from the love of my wife & new son than I ever got in mostly boring Mormon Church meetings, and from the occasional good feelings they claimed "proved" their church was correct. There's a price to be paid for pretty white shirts and pretty buildings.
If feelings can be used as a form of validation, then that means the much better feelings I've had since leaving mean their lies were incorrect.
A. It's bad for you even if you think it's good.
Life in Oregon is rather substantially different than life in Provo (unless you live too close to the Portland Temple).Q. I was a Catholic before I converted to LDS and I wasn't happy but I refuse to bash that religion.
A. Bash away. They need some bashing. Child raping priests? Sounds like a good reason to bash. Have at it!
Q. I have seen no evidence worth my time
A. It was worth your time to write. Is it worth your time to read the responses? If it's not, don't bother complaining in the first place.
Q. I do believe in the church and our prophets, the apostles and the corum of the 70.
A. It's spelled quorum.
Your post is a prime example of why you're not really a happy nor healthy person while being Mormon. Blind ignorance to the life experiences of others. Forcible ignorance to evidence, truth, fact, real history, and so on. You have been abused. You are being abused. And if your children are in the church, they are being abused, for many reasons.Q. I believe in its teachings and how the church was restored by Joseph Smith.
A. More examples of your abused-status.
Q. All that evidence you talk about is made up and false.
A. More evidence of your being in a cult.
Q. This is a life style for active members, not a hobby or just something we do on Sundays.
A. We know damn well what life is like in the Mormon Church.
Q. We cannot be swayed by false propaganda and 'evidence' written by angry inactives or non-members.
A. More evidence that you're not a nice, happy, or healthy person.
If you want to have a dialogue with people who've left, you can have one, you can have a conversation. But NO we won't shut up at your request. We WON'T stop speaking. We WON'T stop calling out problems with the church of our youth. We WON'T stop trying to free people from the abuse - and that includes trying to free YOU from it.
Sincerely,
Jonathan
April 22, 2014
p.s. Regarding the process of science & how it works:
"Trashing" & "tear down" might imply that everything's up for grabs when it isn't. Yes it's the goal of all reasonable honest scientists to try to "tear down" existing theories. To disprove them. To show where they're wrong. But more often than not one theory builds upon another. Einstein's theories didn't destroy Newton's. It simply built upon the previous theory, showed where Newton's claims remain valid (for most of human experience & speeds & viewpoints), and where they fall apart (eg: close to the speed of light or when next to very massive objects). Same goes for other new theories, usually. But when a bigger part of a theory is overturned, we view that with joy, not concern. Cha-ching - we've now learned MORE about the Universe. Super!
The truth finding method of science is far more powerful because of this. Far more accurate results than other methods.
In science you get ahead by disproving or finding flaws with previous theories - and that is it's power.
Related article by Steven Pinker:
Thursday, March 13, 2014
Questions for Mormon Missionaries - God, Sex, and honesty | 16 questions for Mormon Missionaries
Questions for Mormon Missionaries - God, Sex, and honesty | 16 questions for Mormon Missionaries
The Mormon missionaries are knocking at your door.
Be nice to them. Two years of strict abstinence from dating & masturbation. Have pity on these poor naive fools / chumps. I was one, and so I can speak from first hand experience.
Bring them in. Give them some milk and cookies. And then, kindly present to them the following very poignant questions, in all seriousness, and humility, and before the Mormon God & his holy representatives, we ask:
1. Did Joseph Smith enjoy having sex with a 14 year old and with the wives of other men?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Joseph_Smith%27s_wives
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helen_Mar_Kimball
http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,464173,00.html
"...EW What do you think the reaction will be from the Mormon Church?
JK They've already basically let it be known that good Mormons should not read this book. And I think they will be very uncomfortable with the history; they will not like the fact that I point out that Joseph Smith told 14-year-old girls ''God says you should marry me, if you don't...'' His way of getting laid doesn't reflect well on him..."
"...I am especially disappointed that they feel such an urgent need to attack writers, like me, who present balanced, carefully researched accounts of Mormon history that happen to diverge from the official, highly expurgated church version..."
http://www.randomhouse.com/features/krakauer/response.html
Horn Dog Joseph's direct activities to seduce young girls:
http://books.google.com/books?id=0DQaTU7Opq0C&printsec=frontcover&dq=under+the+banner+of+heaven&hl=en&sa=X&ei=eBUiU9X_CcnnkAeRpoFA&ved=0CDcQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=helen%20kimball&f=false
...check out page 122
2. How was the sex between the Mormon God & Mary the Mother of Jesus? When the Mormon God had sex with Mary the Mother of Jesus, did he go down on her? Did he give her head? Did the Mormon God have an orgasm, and did he help Mary have one too? Did they leave their clothes on?
References:
What was it like, when God had sex with Mary?
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2012/12/what-was-it-like-when-god-had-sex-with.html
and "... Jesus Christ is the Son of Elohim both as spiritual and bodily offspring; that is to say, Elohim is literally the Father of the spirit of Jesus Christ and also the body in which Jesus Christ performed His mission in the flesh, and which body died on the cross and was afterward taken up by the process of resurrection, and is now the immortalized tabernacle of the eternal spirit of our Lord and Savior. No extended explanation of the title “Son of God” as applied to Jesus Christ appears necessary..." from https://www.lds.org/ensign/2002/04/the-father-and-the-son?lang=eng
Mormonism and oral sex:
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2013/02/ldsorg-discover-perversity-or-mormonism.html
In 1982, the Mormon God speaks about oral sex through his prophets, seers, and revelators:
Page 1: http://lds-mormon.com/worthy_letter.shtml
page 2: http://lds-mormon.com/worthy_letter1.shtml
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophet,_seer,_and_revelator
A relevant parody of the situation: http://stakepresident.blogspot.com/2011/05/oral-abstinence-key-to-happy-fulfilling.html
3. Was it moral for the Mormon God to have sex with the wife of another man (eg: with Mary)?
4. Was it moral for Brigham Young to have sex with a 15 year old and with the wives of other men?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Brigham_Young%27s_wives
5. How come the more religious a person is the more of an asshole they tend to be?
6. Are intrusive interviews regarding masturbation of 12 year old children conducted by strange men AKA Mormon Bishops a good thing, or a bad & abusive thing?
http://www.mormoncurtain.com/topic_markepeterson.html
And more on masturbation (question 6 & 8 related):
I remember receiving "A Guide to Self-Control" while on my Mormon mission in Alaska.
"...When the temptation to masturbate is strong, yell STOP to those thoughts as loudly as you can in your mind..." Yes, I tried that. Didn't work though. And this is of course an abusive request to make of anyone, especially an 11-21 year old.
Boyd Packer's related evil pamphlet given to Mormon children:
To Young Men Only (PDF)
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B0ZmSLnUooZubEhUOF9OQkdKUk0/view?usp=sharing
7. Where is the Lamaite DNA? Why didn't Joseph Smith know about DNA? Wasn't he supposed to be hooked into the mind of the Mormon God? What about the basic denial of science in the totality of Mormon scripture?
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2013/09/hey-mormon-missionaries-where-is.html
http://nowscape.com/mormon/abraham/abraham.htm
8. When you're in the Mormon Church and you have sex with your wife, are you supposed to leave your garments on or have them off?
Relevant discussion:
http://www.exmormonforums.com/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=2266
http://www.mormoncurtain.com/topic_markepeterson.html#pub_-1343670037
9. How is a woman in Mormonism supposed to have an orgasm without oral sex? See references under question 2.
10. What is the "new name" you received in the Mormon Temple?
http://www.fullerconsideration.com/templenameoracle.php
11. If we say "Health in the navel, marrow in the bones, strength in the loins and sinews. Power in the Priesthood be upon me, and upon my posterity through all generations of time, and throughout all eternity," will we really get into the Mormon Heaven? And do we really want to go there? No oral sex? NO masturbation? A bunch of anally retentive assholes around. And we have to kiss the rear and of a hostile alien god just to get there? Doesn't sound like fun to me - going to the Mormon Heaven? What do you think?
related links:
http://corvus.freeshell.org/psittacus/three/tract/kolob_tract.htm
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2012/12/launch-mission-to-kolob-and-blow-place.html
S.L. Temple "live" version: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b8sbYtFOnxk
Temple film shown in other Mormon temples: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19cHztniXRE
The campy stilted saccharin Mormon view of heaven - in "Man's Search for Happiness:"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L5oS2pZlvgI
12. You're so eager. But young people can also be nieve. Young and dumb. Don't you think you're believe deceived by old fucking farts, like Spencer Kimball, Boyd Packer, and by long dead cult founders like Joseph Smith & Brigham Young.
13. Show the missionaries the film "Jesus Camp" and get their response.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesus_Camp
14. When you get finished on your mission do you plan to attend BYU Idaho, and while there do you plan to complain about your roommates if they happen to have women staying over at night? If the answer is yes, then that means you're still an asshole. Free yourself, young, dumb, naive, Mormon missionary. Don't be a chump or a tool of old farts who just want 10% of your gross income.
15. What about the links between Mormonism and Masonry?
Why are the following photo collections related?
Salt Lake masonic temple images: http://goo.gl/hgIbF5
Mormon Salt Lake temple images: http://goo.gl/lOki78
And an additional question not mentioned in my view:
16. Watch the film "Plan 10 From Outer Space" with the missionaries and get their response.
http://www.echocave.net/plan_10_from_outer_space.html
IMG 8035 - 3-13-2014 7:42am
The Mormon missionaries are knocking at your door.
Be nice to them. Two years of strict abstinence from dating & masturbation. Have pity on these poor naive fools / chumps. I was one, and so I can speak from first hand experience.
Bring them in. Give them some milk and cookies. And then, kindly present to them the following very poignant questions, in all seriousness, and humility, and before the Mormon God & his holy representatives, we ask:
1. Did Joseph Smith enjoy having sex with a 14 year old and with the wives of other men?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Joseph_Smith%27s_wives
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helen_Mar_Kimball
http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,464173,00.html
"...EW What do you think the reaction will be from the Mormon Church?
JK They've already basically let it be known that good Mormons should not read this book. And I think they will be very uncomfortable with the history; they will not like the fact that I point out that Joseph Smith told 14-year-old girls ''God says you should marry me, if you don't...'' His way of getting laid doesn't reflect well on him..."
"...I am especially disappointed that they feel such an urgent need to attack writers, like me, who present balanced, carefully researched accounts of Mormon history that happen to diverge from the official, highly expurgated church version..."
http://www.randomhouse.com/features/krakauer/response.html
Horn Dog Joseph's direct activities to seduce young girls:
http://books.google.com/books?id=0DQaTU7Opq0C&printsec=frontcover&dq=under+the+banner+of+heaven&hl=en&sa=X&ei=eBUiU9X_CcnnkAeRpoFA&ved=0CDcQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=helen%20kimball&f=false
...check out page 122
2. How was the sex between the Mormon God & Mary the Mother of Jesus? When the Mormon God had sex with Mary the Mother of Jesus, did he go down on her? Did he give her head? Did the Mormon God have an orgasm, and did he help Mary have one too? Did they leave their clothes on?
References:
What was it like, when God had sex with Mary?
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2012/12/what-was-it-like-when-god-had-sex-with.html
and "... Jesus Christ is the Son of Elohim both as spiritual and bodily offspring; that is to say, Elohim is literally the Father of the spirit of Jesus Christ and also the body in which Jesus Christ performed His mission in the flesh, and which body died on the cross and was afterward taken up by the process of resurrection, and is now the immortalized tabernacle of the eternal spirit of our Lord and Savior. No extended explanation of the title “Son of God” as applied to Jesus Christ appears necessary..." from https://www.lds.org/ensign/2002/04/the-father-and-the-son?lang=eng
Mormonism and oral sex:
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2013/02/ldsorg-discover-perversity-or-mormonism.html
In 1982, the Mormon God speaks about oral sex through his prophets, seers, and revelators:
Page 1: http://lds-mormon.com/worthy_letter.shtml
page 2: http://lds-mormon.com/worthy_letter1.shtml
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophet,_seer,_and_revelator
A relevant parody of the situation: http://stakepresident.blogspot.com/2011/05/oral-abstinence-key-to-happy-fulfilling.html
3. Was it moral for the Mormon God to have sex with the wife of another man (eg: with Mary)?
4. Was it moral for Brigham Young to have sex with a 15 year old and with the wives of other men?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Brigham_Young%27s_wives
5. How come the more religious a person is the more of an asshole they tend to be?
6. Are intrusive interviews regarding masturbation of 12 year old children conducted by strange men AKA Mormon Bishops a good thing, or a bad & abusive thing?
http://www.mormoncurtain.com/topic_markepeterson.html
And more on masturbation (question 6 & 8 related):
I remember receiving "A Guide to Self-Control" while on my Mormon mission in Alaska.
"...When the temptation to masturbate is strong, yell STOP to those thoughts as loudly as you can in your mind..." Yes, I tried that. Didn't work though. And this is of course an abusive request to make of anyone, especially an 11-21 year old.
Boyd Packer's related evil pamphlet given to Mormon children:
To Young Men Only (PDF)
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B0ZmSLnUooZubEhUOF9OQkdKUk0/view?usp=sharing
7. Where is the Lamaite DNA? Why didn't Joseph Smith know about DNA? Wasn't he supposed to be hooked into the mind of the Mormon God? What about the basic denial of science in the totality of Mormon scripture?
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2013/09/hey-mormon-missionaries-where-is.html
http://nowscape.com/mormon/abraham/abraham.htm
8. When you're in the Mormon Church and you have sex with your wife, are you supposed to leave your garments on or have them off?
Relevant discussion:
http://www.exmormonforums.com/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=2266
http://www.mormoncurtain.com/topic_markepeterson.html#pub_-1343670037
9. How is a woman in Mormonism supposed to have an orgasm without oral sex? See references under question 2.
10. What is the "new name" you received in the Mormon Temple?
http://www.fullerconsideration.com/templenameoracle.php
11. If we say "Health in the navel, marrow in the bones, strength in the loins and sinews. Power in the Priesthood be upon me, and upon my posterity through all generations of time, and throughout all eternity," will we really get into the Mormon Heaven? And do we really want to go there? No oral sex? NO masturbation? A bunch of anally retentive assholes around. And we have to kiss the rear and of a hostile alien god just to get there? Doesn't sound like fun to me - going to the Mormon Heaven? What do you think?
related links:
http://corvus.freeshell.org/psittacus/three/tract/kolob_tract.htm
http://jonathanshome.blogspot.com/2012/12/launch-mission-to-kolob-and-blow-place.html
S.L. Temple "live" version: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b8sbYtFOnxk
Temple film shown in other Mormon temples: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19cHztniXRE
The campy stilted saccharin Mormon view of heaven - in "Man's Search for Happiness:"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L5oS2pZlvgI
12. You're so eager. But young people can also be nieve. Young and dumb. Don't you think you're believe deceived by old fucking farts, like Spencer Kimball, Boyd Packer, and by long dead cult founders like Joseph Smith & Brigham Young.
13. Show the missionaries the film "Jesus Camp" and get their response.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesus_Camp
14. When you get finished on your mission do you plan to attend BYU Idaho, and while there do you plan to complain about your roommates if they happen to have women staying over at night? If the answer is yes, then that means you're still an asshole. Free yourself, young, dumb, naive, Mormon missionary. Don't be a chump or a tool of old farts who just want 10% of your gross income.
15. What about the links between Mormonism and Masonry?
Why are the following photo collections related?
Salt Lake masonic temple images: http://goo.gl/hgIbF5
Mormon Salt Lake temple images: http://goo.gl/lOki78
And an additional question not mentioned in my view:
16. Watch the film "Plan 10 From Outer Space" with the missionaries and get their response.
http://www.echocave.net/plan_10_from_outer_space.html
IMG 8035 - 3-13-2014 7:42am
Tuesday, February 4, 2014
Dead Sea Scrolls exhibit, Leonardo Museum, a review - February 2014
Review of our Sunday February 2nd, 2014 visit to the Utah Science and
Technology Arts Museum (also known as the Leonard Museum), in Salt Lake
City, Utah.
Currently on display is a Dead Sea Scrolls exhibit there, an exhibit which appears to be rotating around to various museums.
The admission price for the special exhibit is very high.
Here's what you'll see in side:
1. Sand on the floor.
2. Old pottery.
3. Old coins.
4. A few very small pieces of the scrolls, which are impossible to read or view in any reasonable way. Blown up images of the few pieces brought.
5. Staff who state that they believe in prayer.
6. A replica of the Jerusalem wailing wall (western temple wall), into which you can place a prayer paper, which will supposedly later be taken to Jerusalem.
7. A special Utah section about the Dead Sea Scrolls that talks about the contribution of Utahns - mainly talking about the involvement of the group FARMS (Foundation for Ancient Research and Mormon Studies - now the Neal A. Maxwell Institute for Religious Scholarship at BYU), and strangely about the DNA work of Scott Woodward. FARMS and it's successor serve as a "scholarly" "scientific" apologetic instrument of the Mormon Church.
Mention of Scott Woodward's DNA work in the Utah section was particularly appalling. Where is the Lamanite DNA? Google plant geneticist Simon Southerton to find out - there is none. FARMS/Maxwell/BYU apologetic pseudoscience has no place in an honest science museum.
References:
DNA Genealogies of American Indians and the Book of Mormon
http://www.exmormon.org/whylft125.htm
Losing a Lost Tribe: Native Americans, DNA, and the Mormon Church
http://www.amazon.com/Losing-Lost-Tribe-Native-Americans/dp/1560851813
Simon Southerton, DNA, Lamanites and the Book of Mormon
http://mormonstories.org/348-349-simon-southerton-dna-lamanites-and-the-book-of-mormon/
Dr. Southerton's blog:
http://simonsoutherton.blogspot.com
Science on prayer - as per a study paid for by a group who seeks in my view to otherwise distort science (Templeton Foundation):
Study of the Therapeutic Effects of Intercessory Prayer
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Study_of_the_Therapeutic_Effects_of_Intercessory_Prayer
FARMS info:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundation_for_Ancient_Research_and_Mormon_Studies
FARMS articles at the Mormon Curtain website:
http://www.mormoncurtain.com/topic_farms.html
Salamander Society article on FARMS:
http://www.salamandersociety.com/apologetics/
Shake-up hits BYU's Mormon studies institute
http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/utes/54358137-78/mormon-institute-peterson-studies.html.csp
Review created February 3, 2014 - 7:11am, 7:24am, 11:27am to about noon
Wednesday, June 19, 2013
explorations & activities after leaving Mormonism: nudism, & Temple Square protests
explorations & activities made after leaving Mormonism: Protests at Temple Square in 1999 and 2002. Nudist group experiences. Nudists claim their activities have nothing to do with sex. Such a claim is a lie, and an indicator that Puritanism infects even this aspect of American culture.
By the term "girl" I mean an attractive woman. References:
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/girl
"2. a young unmarried woman; lass; maid"
"4. Informal a woman of any age"
12-24-2014 addendum:
In response to the question posted in a comment below, regarding have I ever been to a nudist event:
Yes I have. Some of the leadership of those activities are very highly hipocritical. Claiming that events are "non-sexual," when they themselves are self-proclaimed "sex goddesness." But the truth only comes out after a while.
The general American nudist position on sexuality shows how they are very much afraid of sex and how they are inhibited. Adding and stating many extra rules for behavior when people have their clothes off - rules never ever stated when people are at parties with their clothes on - it's all nn indication of their being completely and fully inhibited while lying about being uninhibited. This is the general state of nudism in America today.
It's a fundamental lie to assume that sexuality is ever disconnected from an activity when *adult* humans are together naked. To claim this, to think this, and to require that others think this as a condition of participation, is abusive, hypocritical, just plain crazy, and an indication of some type of Puritanical memetic disease pervading nudist culture.
Nudists in America express even more fear of sex, when their clothes are off!
Uninhibited? I don't think so.
Related thoughts from others:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/rec.nude/9Say7QWoaT4[1-25-false]
Anyway, there's something particularly perverse about asking humans to get naked, and them playing mind games with them and with yourself by claiming that when adults get naked the activities are "non-sexual." That's just plain bullshit. Utter abusive bullshit. A lie. And why? One may well ask. Perhaps nudism as it stands today is really a playground for liars, so long as they keep up what they're doing & claiming.
Adult humans are sexual animals. Taking your clothes off can mean "being free," but don't ever claim that your nudist event where adult humans can see each other naked is "non sexual." If you do, you're a liar.
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